Drawing a pistol - Yeager

[Fenway]

YouTube - Drawing a Pistol

 

[cedartop]

Good video. James has some good points. In particular using the blue gun(grey in this case), and the emphasis on the non-need for speed reholstering. There is no rush to put that gun back in the holster.

We teach a 5 count draw, then ween it down to 3 pretty much like shown. I don't believe in teaching the side step to beginners, but movement is definitely brought in down the road. (Hint, more than a sidestep).

He is pretty funny with his admonishments to buy some dvd's and quit asking for free training. We all want something for nothing.

 

[Coach]

How does one teach the draw stroke and not break it down into steps? Ideally the draw stroke is many mechanical things happening in a seamless motion. 3, 4, or a 5 step process will make people draw like Mr. Roboto or C3PO. Looking for other instructors to chime in. Spent the day teaching and one concern I always have is producing students with a fluid and seamless draw stroke.

 

[Joe Williams]

Some things I don't like about that. If you are in a position where you need to draw quickly, you are close enough that you may well not have time or distance to press the gun out and look for that front sight. You need to be ready to fire as soon as you clear. If you aren't that close, running to cover is more important than draw speed. If you are that close, time spent moving your off hand all the way across your chest is wasted time, and you have trained yourself to not be using that hand to fend off an attacker at close range while drawing and firing with the other hand. I also think that training yourself to move hands and body into a set posture makes it much more difficult to draw on the move, which is what you should be doing. Have you ever seen the contortions some folks go through when they try to draw from anything but a static position? What he (and others) teach is fine if you are in an OK Corral gunfight, but there are better and equally (or almost as equally fast) methods of getting your gun into action better suited to the scenarios most likely to require a fast draw for a private citizen.

IMHO, anyway.

 

[shooter521]

there are better and equally (or almost as equally fast) methods of getting your gun into action better suited to the scenarios most likely to require a fast draw for a private citizen.

Such as? Not being argumentative, just curious.

 

[Joe Williams]

Such as? Not being argumentative, just curious.

Such as, for example, not bringing your off hand all the way across the body. I was taught to bring the off hand up to chest height (basically right up to the nipple on my off side), not all the way across the body. You can still bring the hands together on the press out, but the off hand is more available to protect yourself, and you've minimized unnecessary movement. I was also taught to be able to draw, fire, and hit independent of what the weak hand is doing. My biggest gripe is teaching yourself to draw from a fixed stance. It limits your ability to get your gun into action in any but the most ideal situations.

I'm having a hard time explaining myself in writing

 

[shooter521]

You can still bring the hands together on the press out, but the off hand is more available to protect yourself

IMO, the key is that the hands meet at the body (if, in fact, they're going to meet; that is, if your support hand isn't otherwise occupied) rather than out in space.

 

[Prometheus]

Some things I don't like about that. If you are in a position where you need to draw quickly, you are close enough that you may well not have time or distance to press the gun out and look for that front sight. You need to be ready to fire as soon as you clear. If you aren't that close, running to cover is more important than draw speed.

I don't know how fast you draw vs how fast you run, but I'm a fast runner and draw decently. I don't follow on this line of thinking, especially if you are with your family.

If you are that close, time spent moving your off hand all the way across your chest is wasted time, and you have trained yourself to not be using that hand to fend off an attacker at close range while drawing and firing with the other hand.

Moving my hands (including off hand) takes .09 seconds. Last time I was clocked with .87 seconds as my fastest time from hand on my holstered gun vs .96 seconds, I don't think that I sacrifice even .01 seconds by getting my support hand "all the way over" to my strong side, the support hand hits much sooner than my primary can complete all of it's tasks leading up them joining. There are people a lot faster than I am, but having a solid grip 100% of the time by using what yeager shows in the video is extremely important. Especially when you push the pistol in your palm and blow a hole in it because you were trying to randomly grab at it.

You can train yourself for several types of responses, what Yeager is teaching works equally well for contact distance, if you notice, the gun hand is tight into the body, not just for meeting the off hand, but also for retention purposes. The support hand can do other things and as Yeager points out, you can fire as you extend the pistol.

I also think that training yourself to move hands and body into a set posture makes it much more difficult to draw on the move, which is what you should be doing. Have you ever seen the contortions some folks go through when they try to draw from anything but a static position?

Ever heard you have to crawl before you walk and walk before you can run?

What he (and others) teach is fine if you are in an OK Corral gunfight, but there are better and equally (or almost as equally fast) methods of getting your gun into action better suited to the scenarios most likely to require a fast draw for a private citizen.

IMHO, anyway.

What are they? I'd love to know, because I want the best methods and tactics I can.

 

[HICKMAN]

My biggest gripe is teaching yourself to draw from a fixed stance. It limits your ability to get your gun into action in any but the most ideal situations.

that was actually a point made in class today, about having the "luxury" of drawing from a good stance.

 

[Steve MI]

how about doing it from an untucked shirt or jacket the support hand reaches across if it can be used< to grip the shirt at the bottom edge of the holster or close to it and rip straight up to about the nipple line to meet the gun other wise its opening doors guarding or working a light or phone holding the trolls etc.....

 

[Steve MI]

How does one teach the draw stroke and not break it down into steps? Ideally the draw stroke is many mechanical things happening in a seamless motion. 3, 4, or a 5 step process will make people draw like Mr. Roboto or C3PO. Looking for other instructors to chime in. Spent the day teaching and one concern I always have is producing students with a fluid and seamless draw stroke.

coach, i usually demo it as one fluid motion and break it down as to how im doing it and its goals... kind of hard to explain over the net but ... i generally explain the thoughts concepts of each i drive to the gun the drive the gun to the threat kind of like a straight punch coach if your open your welcome you or rhino are welcome to come down to the hg-1 we are doing a lovemywoods in june and sit in and talk shop etc.....

 

[SSGSAD]

I stand in front of a mirror, and PRACTICE, a lot.... might not be textbook, but it works for me....

 

[Sailor]

Shooting from retention while fending off an attacker at contact distance is taught in his class. The situation determines how you draw. He is just showing one.

Different draws are taught in the class for one handed, weak hand, on your back, retention etc. You get the idea.

 

[rvb]

How does one teach the draw stroke and not break it down into steps? ... step process will make people draw like Mr. Roboto or C3PO. ... one concern I always have is producing students with a fluid and seamless draw stroke.

They way I've taught basic draw it is to teach the steps, followed by the "c3po" of 1 then 2 etc, followed by SLOWLY going through the steps w/ the goal of always keeping the hands moving... as if done on a slow-mo movie. From there speed can be gradually increased. Super slow mo gives you, as instructor, the ability to make sure the student "hits their marks" on each step w/o being jerky. Goal is to be smooth. The student can begin engraining the feel of a smooth draw while still hitting the technical steps.

Multipe-par timers can really help here, eg 1 sec for each step, then dial down.

-rvb

 

[Joe Williams]

I don't know how fast you draw vs how fast you run, but I'm a fast runner and draw decently. I don't follow on this line of thinking, especially if you are with your family.
snip.

My family is running away, too... and not in the same direction I am. The person with a gun just became a target, and I don't want them near me if at all possible. If it's up close and personal, as it most likely will be, they are on the ground.

 

[cedartop]

My family is running away, too... and not in the same direction I am. The person with a gun just became a target, and I don't want them near me if at all possible. If it's up close and personal, as it most likely will be, they are on the ground.

Joe, I can agree with this, but if I am teaching someone who doesn't yet know how to draw, I sure am not gonna start them out by teaching them to draw while sprinting off the X. Like most things it can be important to learn the basics first.

 

[Mudcat]

Shooting from retention while fending off an attacker at contact distance is taught in his class. The situation determines how you draw. He is just showing one.

Different draws are taught in the class for one handed, weak hand, on your back, retention etc. You get the idea.

Yep what he said. This is the basic draw that he teaches, you get more advanced as the class progresses. I wore a IWB holster and a t-shirt un-tucked and used both hands to pull the shirt up with the off hand holding it up while over my pec.

 

[Prometheus]

My family is running away, too... and not in the same direction I am. The person with a gun just became a target, and I don't want them near me if at all possible. If it's up close and personal, as it most likely will be, they are on the ground.

I hope you practice that.... all of you.

Aside from our disagreements here, I think we can agree that some of us (including me) are going to have a hard time running with a pair of toddlers.

FWIW, assuming 2 assailants at 7 yards and it's going to be over in under 2 seconds. There isn't going to be time, IMO, for much scooting. Getting off the X is one thing, moving to cover assumes some far distances and time.

 

[Sailor]

I stand in front of a mirror, and PRACTICE, a lot.... might not be textbook, but it works for me....

You talking to me! I said you talking to me?

 

[nowuckers]

I should have watched this before the weekend... especially the bit about re-holstering