CIVIL RELIGIOUS DISCUSSION: All things Christianity

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    JettaKnight

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    There is a crucial difference than accepting what the Church teaches and admitting that the Church could be right. Doubt is ok, denial is not.
    Now we're back to a happy place. I'll admit it - I want to have it all figured out. I want to know the exact, correct truth. Therefore, I'm a bit of a Red Green sort of guy when it comes to theology and it's hard to say, "I don't know". To counter this, I'm quick to point out places where I might be wrong - incl. Baptism.

    There can be no slippery slope though. Study Orthodoxy for long and you will find that the biggest complaint is that the theology don't change and hasn't changed hardly at all since the 7th ecumenical council.
    It's not Orthodox theology that I'm worried about.
    The history of doctrine in the east can be covered in less than a thousand pages with the first half a shared history with the east and the west. The History of doctrine in the west to the 1700s would fill 3 more volumes and would be busting at the seams by the end of the 20th century.
    I remember my courses at Purdue, while excellent, just whetted my appetite of Church history.
     

    foszoe

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    The Nicene Creed is preferred because it was accepted by the whole Church in council. The Apostle's Creed seems to be later in origin but in general its history is less well known. The Nicene addresses several more heresies that arose. Notice the expanded statements about Christ etc.

    Here is the Nicene Creed

    I believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of
    heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

    And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of
    God, begotten of the Father before all ages;
    Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten,
    not created, of one essence with the Father
    through Whom all things were made.
    Who for us men and for our salvation
    came down from heaven and was incarnate
    of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man.
    He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate,
    and suffered and was buried;
    And He rose on the third day,
    according to the Scriptures.
    He ascended into heaven
    and is seated at the right hand of the Father;
    And He will come again with glory to judge the living
    and dead. His kingdom shall have no end.

    And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life,
    Who proceeds from the Father, Who together with the
    Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who
    spoke through the prophets.


    In one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church.
    I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
    I look for the resurrection of the dead,
    and the life of the age to come.
    Amen.

    Not really directed at anyone specific, it just fit with the quote function: is the apostles creed not sufficient?

    I believe in God, the Father almighty,
    creator of heaven and earth.
    I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord,
    who was conceived by the Holy Spirit
    and born of the virgin Mary.
    He suffered under Pontius Pilate,
    was crucified, died, and was buried;
    he descended to hell.
    The third day he rose again from the dead.
    He ascended to heaven
    and is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty.
    From there he will come to judge the living and the dead.
    I believe in the Holy Spirit,
    the holy catholic* church,
    the communion of saints,
    the forgiveness of sins,
    the resurrection of the body,
    and the life everlasting. Amen.
    *that is, the true Christian church of all times and all places
     

    JettaKnight

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    I think I just addressed these concerns in my most recent post

    so short answers.

    No. Yes, but only when in Church. (you guys don't sing from several different hymnal pages all at the same time do you?). Yes, but it should be in the local language. AS an aside, it was the Orthodox promulgated that the preaching and reading should be done in the local language not the Protestants. We had the jump on that by about 700 years when Cyril and Methodius went north and gave the Russians the "Cyrillic" alphabet!

    and finally, Yes.

    Sadly, we don't open our hymnals. :(


    So, we're pretty much where you want us to be. The exception is, that we've replaced, "I don't know" with an answer for those minor "veiled things". You point to that, "see disunity!", whereas if we are just silent...

    They have confetti sprinkles on their ice cream and you have nuts!

    (Funny story: Our church did have an ice cream fellowship with a former Baptist church here in town.)

    Here's the rub - There's eighty bazillion churches here in Fort Wayne (i.e. The City of Churches) - there's a whole of protestants going to church on Sunday. Some of these new churches were planted, some were breakaways, many were ethnic (i.e. German Lutheran or AME), and yet others are spontaneous. Just the simple logistics dictate that there be so many churches, and if there's so many, why should they be alike? I don't see any harm in diversity.

    It seems like the Orthodox church really hasn't had this problem of rapid growth and division (I think there's only one in Fort Wayne). As far as I know even the RCC hasn't seen growth spurts like the Great Revival - they simply have controlled, planned growth from the lack of contraception. :):
     

    foszoe

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    Below is the reception into the Catechumenate. Note this isn't the Baptism, it's just the beginning of the preparation for Baptism that can take months (usually) or even years (sometimes)

    I bet most protestants worth their salt would consider the Catechumenate "saved" before we ever get around to baptizing him based just on the prayers below. I post these just to show that the prayers of repentance and conversion while they may sound foreign, share more than the average Protestant might believe.

    An underlying emphasis though is on unity and communion. No priest's prayer is considered efficacious unless accompanied by the Amen of the people. The work done is accomplished by all present through the power of the One who promises where 2 or 3 are gathered together, there he will be.

    It's all there, the Book of Life, the power of the Blood, and I would challenge you to show me a church that believes Satan/the Devil exists and combats him in such clear language :)

    Read the prayers and tell me what YOU think.


    Orthodox Church in America
    2012


    Reception into the Catechumenate


    The priest, vested in stole (and phelonion and cuffs if it be the custom) comes out of the
    Sanctuary and goes to the vestibule of the Church where the sponsors with the child
    await him.


    The priest breathes gently in the face of the child. He makes the Sign of the Cross over
    the child and lays his right hand upon the child’s head.


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: In Thy Name, O Lord of truth, and in the Name of Thine Only begotten
    Son, and of Thy holy Spirit, I lay my hand upon Thy servant,
    ______, who has been found worthy to flee unto Thy holy name, and
    to take refuge under the shelter of Thy wings. Remove far from him
    (her) his (her) former delusion, and fill him (her) with the faith, hope
    and love which are in Thee; that he (she) may know that Thou art the
    only true God, with Thine Only-begotten Son, our Lord Jesus Christ,
    and Thy Holy Spirit. Enable him (her) to walk in all Thy
    commandments, and to fulfill those things which are well-pleasing
    unto Thee; for if a man do those things, he shall find life in them.
    Inscribe him (her) in Thy Book of Life, and unite him (her) to the flock
    of Thine inheritance. May Thy holy Name be glorified in him (her),
    together with that of Thy beloved Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, and of
    Thy life-creating Spirit. Let Thine eyes ever regard him (her) with
    mercy, and let Thine ears attend to the voice of his (her) supplication.
    Let him (her) rejoice in the works of his (her) hands, and in all his (her)
    generation; that he (she) may render praises unto Thee, may sing,
    worship and glorify Thy great and exalted Name always, all the days
    of his (her) life.
    For all the Powers of Heaven sing praises unto Thee, and
    Thine is the glory, of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,
    now and ever and unto ages of ages.
    1
    People: Amen.


    First Exorcism
    Priest: The Lord puts you under ban, O Devil: He Who came into the world,
    and made His abode among men, that He might overthrow your
    tyranny and deliver men. Who also upon the Tree did triumph over
    the adverse powers, when the sun was darkened, and the earth did
    quake, and the graves were opened, and the bodies of the Saints
    arose; Who also by death annihilated Death, and overthrew him who
    exercised the dominion of Death, that is you, the Devil. I charge you
    by God, Who revealed the Tree of Life, and arrayed in ranks the
    Cherubim and the flaming sword which turns all ways to guard it: be
    under ban. For I charge you by Him who walked upon the surface of
    the sea as if it were dry land, and laid under His ban the tempests of
    the winds; Whose glance dries up the deep, and Whose command
    makes the mountains melt away. The same now, through us, puts
    you under ban. Fear, begone and depart from this creature, and
    return not again, neither hide yourself in him (her), neither seek to
    meet him (her), nor to influence him (her), either by night or by day,
    either in the morning or at noonday; but depart hence to your own
    infernal abyss until the great Day of Judgment which is ordained. Fear
    God Who sits upon the Cherubim and looks upon the deeps; before
    Whom tremble Angels and Archangels, Thrones, Dominions,
    Principalities, Authorities, Powers, the many-eyed Cherubim and the
    six-winged Seraphim; before Whom, likewise, heaven and earth do
    quake, the seas and all that they contain. Begone, and depart from
    this sealed, newly-enlisted warrior of Christ our God. For I charge you
    by Him Who rides upon the wings of the wind, and makes His Angels
    spirits, and His ministers a flaming fire: Begone, and depart from this
    creature, with all your powers and your Angels.
    For glorified is the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of
    the Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.
    People: Amen.


    Second Exorcism


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: God, holy, awesome and glorious, Who is unsearchable and
    inscrutable in all His works and might, has foreordained for you the
    penalty of eternal punishment, O Devil. The same God, through us,
    His unworthy servant, commands you, with all your hosts, to depart
    from him (her) who has been newly sealed in the Name of our Lord
    Jesus Christ, our true God. Wherefore I charge you, most crafty,
    impure, vile, loathsome and alien spirit, by the might of Jesus Christ,
    Who has all power, both in heaven and on earth, Who said to the
    deaf and dumb demon, "Come out of the man, and in nowise enter a
    second time into him:" Depart! Acknowledge the vainness of your
    might, which has not power even over swine. Call to mind Him Who,
    at your request, commanded you to enter into the herd of swine. Fear
    God, by Whose decree the earth is established upon the waters; Who
    has made the heavens, and has set the mountains with a line and the
    valleys with a measure; and has fixed bounds to the sands of the sea,
    and a firm path upon the stormy waters; Who touches the mountains
    and they smoke; Who clothes Himself with light as with a garment;
    Who spreads out the heavens like a curtain; Who covers His
    exceedingly high places with the waters; Who has made the earth so
    sure upon its foundations, that it shall never be moved; Who gathers
    the water of the sea and pours it out upon the face of the whole earth:
    Begone, and depart from him (her) who has made himself (herself)
    ready for Holy Illumination. I charge you by the redeeming Passion of
    our Lord Jesus Christ, and by His precious Body and Blood, and by
    His awesome Coming-again; for He shall come, and shall not tarry, to
    judge the whole earth; and He shall chastise you and all your host
    with burning Gehenna, committing you to outer darkness, where the
    worm does not cease and the fire is not quenched.
    For of Christ our God is the dominion, with the Father and the
    Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    Third Exorcism


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Lord of Sabaoth, the God of Israel, Who healest every malady and
    every infirmity: Look upon Thy servant; prove him (her) and search
    him (her) and root out of him (her) every operation of the devil.
    Rebuke the unclean spirits and expel them, and purify the works of
    Thy hands; and exerting Thy trenchant might, speedily crush down
    Satan under his (her) feet; and give him (her) victory over the same,
    and over his unclean spirits; that, having obtained mercy from Thee,
    he (she) may be made worthy to partake of Thy heavenly Mysteries;
    and may ascribe unto Thee glory, to the Father, and to the Son, and to
    the Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    A Fourth Prayer


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Lord and Master, Who created man in Thine own likeness, and
    bestowed upon him the power of life eternal; Who also despisest not
    those who have fallen away through sin, but providest salvation for
    the world through the incarnation of Thy Christ; Do Thou, the same
    Lord, delivering also this Thy creature from the bondage of the
    enemy, receive him (her) into Thy heavenly Kingdom. Open the eyes
    of his (her) understanding, that the illumination of Thy Gospel may
    shine brightly in him (her). Assign to his (her) life an Angel of light who
    shall deliver him (her) from every snare of the adversary, from
    encounter with evil, from the demon of the noonday, and from evil
    thoughts.


    The Priest then breathes gently in the form of a cross over the mouth, brow, and breast,
    saying three times:
    Expel from him (her) every evil and unclean spirit which hides and
    makes its lair in his (her) heart. (3x)


    Priest: The spirit of deceit, the spirit of evil, the spirit of idolatry and of every
    covetousness; the spirit of falsehood and of every uncleanness, which
    operates through the prompting of the devil. And make him (her) a
    reason-endowed sheep in the holy flock of Thy Christ, an honorable
    member of Thy Church, a consecrated vessel, a child of the light and
    an heir of Thy Kingdom, that having lived in accordance with Thy
    commandments, and preserved inviolate the seal, and kept his (her)
    garment undefiled, he (she) may receive the blessedness of the Saints
    in Thy Kingdom.


    The sponsors with the child (or the one to be baptized if he be an adult) turn about and
    face the West, with their backs to the priest. The priest then asks the following question
    three times:

    Priest: Do you renounce Satan, and all his works, and all his angels, and all
    his service, and all his pride? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I do renounce him!


    Priest: Have you renounced Satan? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I have renounced him!


    Then the priest says:
    Priest: Breathe and spit upon him!


    The sponsors with the child (or adult) now turn about back to the East, and they stand
    facing the priest. The priest asks them three times:
    Do you unite yourself to Christ? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I do unite myself to Christ.


    Then the priest asks another question:
    Priest: Have you united yourself to Christ?


    Candidate: I have united myself to Christ.


    Priest: Do you believe in Him?


    Candidate: I believe in Him as King and God.


    Candidate Recites The Symbol of Faith


    I believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all
    things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the onlybegotten,
    begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of light; true God of true God;
    begotten, not made; of one essence with the Father, by Whom all things were made;
    Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate
    of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, and became man. And He was crucified for
    us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered, and was buried. And the third day He rose
    again, according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sits at the right
    hand of the Father; and He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the
    dead; Whose Kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the
    Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father; Who with the Father and the Son
    together is worshipped and glorified; Who spoke by the Prophets. And in one holy,
    catholic, and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of
    sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

    After the Creed, the Priest makes the following inquiry three times:
    Priest: Have you united yourself to Christ? (Three times)


    The child (or Sponsor) responds each time:
    Candidate: I have united myself to Christ.


    Priest: Bow down before Him.


    Candidate: (bowing) I bow down before the Father, and the Son, and the Holy
    Spirit, the Trinity, one in essence and undivided.


    Priest: Blessed is God, Who desirest that all men be saved and come to the
    knowledge of the truth, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Master, Lord our God, call Thy servant, ______, to Thy holy
    Illumination, and grant to him (her) that great grace of Thy holy
    Baptism. Put off from him (her) the old man, and renew him (her) unto
    life everlasting; and fill him (her) with the power of Thy Holy Spirit, in
    the unity of Thy Christ; that he (she) may be no more a child of the
    body, but a child of Thy Kingdom. Through the good will and grace
    of Thine Only-begotten Son, with Whom Thou art blessed, together
    with Thy most holy, good, and life-creating Spirit, now ever and unto
    ages of ages.


    People: Amen
     

    foszoe

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    And we do all the above without mentioning Mary! *gasp* well once in the Creed I guess :)
     

    ATM

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    ...It's all there, the Book of Life, the power of the Blood, and I would challenge you to show me a church that believes Satan/the Devil exists and combats him in such clear language... :)

    How could any Christian ignore or deny such truth? Our battle is not against flesh and blood.
     

    indiucky

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    What do you have against the Dutch? :dunno:

    It's the haircuts...He just doesn't like the haircuts....

    dutch-boy-icon.jpg
     

    2A_Tom

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    Yep, that is exactly how peter did it on Pentecost.

    Acts 2:41 | View whole chapter | See verse in contextThen they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were addedunto them about three thousand souls.
    Below is the reception into the Catechumenate. Note this isn't the Baptism, it's just the beginning of the preparation for Baptism that can take months (usually) or even years (sometimes)

    I bet most protestants worth their salt would consider the Catechumenate "saved" before we ever get around to baptizing him based just on the prayers below. I post these just to show that the prayers of repentance and conversion while they may sound foreign, share more than the average Protestant might believe.

    An underlying emphasis though is on unity and communion. No priest's prayer is considered efficacious unless accompanied by the Amen of the people. The work done is accomplished by all present through the power of the One who promises where 2 or 3 are gathered together, there he will be.

    It's all there, the Book of Life, the power of the Blood, and I would challenge you to show me a church that believes Satan/the Devil exists and combats him in such clear language :)

    Read the prayers and tell me what YOU think.


    Orthodox Church in America
    2012


    Reception into the Catechumenate


    The priest, vested in stole (and phelonion and cuffs if it be the custom) comes out of the
    Sanctuary and goes to the vestibule of the Church where the sponsors with the child
    await him.


    The priest breathes gently in the face of the child. He makes the Sign of the Cross over
    the child and lays his right hand upon the child’s head.


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: In Thy Name, O Lord of truth, and in the Name of Thine Only begotten
    Son, and of Thy holy Spirit, I lay my hand upon Thy servant,
    ______, who has been found worthy to flee unto Thy holy name, and
    to take refuge under the shelter of Thy wings. Remove far from him
    (her) his (her) former delusion, and fill him (her) with the faith, hope
    and love which are in Thee; that he (she) may know that Thou art the
    only true God, with Thine Only-begotten Son, our Lord Jesus Christ,
    and Thy Holy Spirit. Enable him (her) to walk in all Thy
    commandments, and to fulfill those things which are well-pleasing
    unto Thee; for if a man do those things, he shall find life in them.
    Inscribe him (her) in Thy Book of Life, and unite him (her) to the flock
    of Thine inheritance. May Thy holy Name be glorified in him (her),
    together with that of Thy beloved Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, and of
    Thy life-creating Spirit. Let Thine eyes ever regard him (her) with
    mercy, and let Thine ears attend to the voice of his (her) supplication.
    Let him (her) rejoice in the works of his (her) hands, and in all his (her)
    generation; that he (she) may render praises unto Thee, may sing,
    worship and glorify Thy great and exalted Name always, all the days
    of his (her) life.
    For all the Powers of Heaven sing praises unto Thee, and
    Thine is the glory, of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,
    now and ever and unto ages of ages.
    1
    People: Amen.


    First Exorcism
    Priest: The Lord puts you under ban, O Devil: He Who came into the world,
    and made His abode among men, that He might overthrow your
    tyranny and deliver men. Who also upon the Tree did triumph over
    the adverse powers, when the sun was darkened, and the earth did
    quake, and the graves were opened, and the bodies of the Saints
    arose; Who also by death annihilated Death, and overthrew him who
    exercised the dominion of Death, that is you, the Devil. I charge you
    by God, Who revealed the Tree of Life, and arrayed in ranks the
    Cherubim and the flaming sword which turns all ways to guard it: be
    under ban. For I charge you by Him who walked upon the surface of
    the sea as if it were dry land, and laid under His ban the tempests of
    the winds; Whose glance dries up the deep, and Whose command
    makes the mountains melt away. The same now, through us, puts
    you under ban. Fear, begone and depart from this creature, and
    return not again, neither hide yourself in him (her), neither seek to
    meet him (her), nor to influence him (her), either by night or by day,
    either in the morning or at noonday; but depart hence to your own
    infernal abyss until the great Day of Judgment which is ordained. Fear
    God Who sits upon the Cherubim and looks upon the deeps; before
    Whom tremble Angels and Archangels, Thrones, Dominions,
    Principalities, Authorities, Powers, the many-eyed Cherubim and the
    six-winged Seraphim; before Whom, likewise, heaven and earth do
    quake, the seas and all that they contain. Begone, and depart from
    this sealed, newly-enlisted warrior of Christ our God. For I charge you
    by Him Who rides upon the wings of the wind, and makes His Angels
    spirits, and His ministers a flaming fire: Begone, and depart from this
    creature, with all your powers and your Angels.
    For glorified is the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of
    the Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.
    People: Amen.


    Second Exorcism


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: God, holy, awesome and glorious, Who is unsearchable and
    inscrutable in all His works and might, has foreordained for you the
    penalty of eternal punishment, O Devil. The same God, through us,
    His unworthy servant, commands you, with all your hosts, to depart
    from him (her) who has been newly sealed in the Name of our Lord
    Jesus Christ, our true God. Wherefore I charge you, most crafty,
    impure, vile, loathsome and alien spirit, by the might of Jesus Christ,
    Who has all power, both in heaven and on earth, Who said to the
    deaf and dumb demon, "Come out of the man, and in nowise enter a
    second time into him:" Depart! Acknowledge the vainness of your
    might, which has not power even over swine. Call to mind Him Who,
    at your request, commanded you to enter into the herd of swine. Fear
    God, by Whose decree the earth is established upon the waters; Who
    has made the heavens, and has set the mountains with a line and the
    valleys with a measure; and has fixed bounds to the sands of the sea,
    and a firm path upon the stormy waters; Who touches the mountains
    and they smoke; Who clothes Himself with light as with a garment;
    Who spreads out the heavens like a curtain; Who covers His
    exceedingly high places with the waters; Who has made the earth so
    sure upon its foundations, that it shall never be moved; Who gathers
    the water of the sea and pours it out upon the face of the whole earth:
    Begone, and depart from him (her) who has made himself (herself)
    ready for Holy Illumination. I charge you by the redeeming Passion of
    our Lord Jesus Christ, and by His precious Body and Blood, and by
    His awesome Coming-again; for He shall come, and shall not tarry, to
    judge the whole earth; and He shall chastise you and all your host
    with burning Gehenna, committing you to outer darkness, where the
    worm does not cease and the fire is not quenched.
    For of Christ our God is the dominion, with the Father and the
    Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    Third Exorcism


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Lord of Sabaoth, the God of Israel, Who healest every malady and
    every infirmity: Look upon Thy servant; prove him (her) and search
    him (her) and root out of him (her) every operation of the devil.
    Rebuke the unclean spirits and expel them, and purify the works of
    Thy hands; and exerting Thy trenchant might, speedily crush down
    Satan under his (her) feet; and give him (her) victory over the same,
    and over his unclean spirits; that, having obtained mercy from Thee,
    he (she) may be made worthy to partake of Thy heavenly Mysteries;
    and may ascribe unto Thee glory, to the Father, and to the Son, and to
    the Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    A Fourth Prayer


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Lord and Master, Who created man in Thine own likeness, and
    bestowed upon him the power of life eternal; Who also despisest not
    those who have fallen away through sin, but providest salvation for
    the world through the incarnation of Thy Christ; Do Thou, the same
    Lord, delivering also this Thy creature from the bondage of the
    enemy, receive him (her) into Thy heavenly Kingdom. Open the eyes
    of his (her) understanding, that the illumination of Thy Gospel may
    shine brightly in him (her). Assign to his (her) life an Angel of light who
    shall deliver him (her) from every snare of the adversary, from
    encounter with evil, from the demon of the noonday, and from evil
    thoughts.


    The Priest then breathes gently in the form of a cross over the mouth, brow, and breast,
    saying three times:
    Expel from him (her) every evil and unclean spirit which hides and
    makes its lair in his (her) heart. (3x)


    Priest: The spirit of deceit, the spirit of evil, the spirit of idolatry and of every
    covetousness; the spirit of falsehood and of every uncleanness, which
    operates through the prompting of the devil. And make him (her) a
    reason-endowed sheep in the holy flock of Thy Christ, an honorable
    member of Thy Church, a consecrated vessel, a child of the light and
    an heir of Thy Kingdom, that having lived in accordance with Thy
    commandments, and preserved inviolate the seal, and kept his (her)
    garment undefiled, he (she) may receive the blessedness of the Saints
    in Thy Kingdom.


    The sponsors with the child (or the one to be baptized if he be an adult) turn about and
    face the West, with their backs to the priest. The priest then asks the following question
    three times:

    Priest: Do you renounce Satan, and all his works, and all his angels, and all
    his service, and all his pride? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I do renounce him!


    Priest: Have you renounced Satan? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I have renounced him!


    Then the priest says:
    Priest: Breathe and spit upon him!


    The sponsors with the child (or adult) now turn about back to the East, and they stand
    facing the priest. The priest asks them three times:
    Do you unite yourself to Christ? (Three times)


    And each time the sponsor, or the one to be baptized if he be an adult, answers:
    Candidate: I do unite myself to Christ.


    Then the priest asks another question:
    Priest: Have you united yourself to Christ?


    Candidate: I have united myself to Christ.


    Priest: Do you believe in Him?


    Candidate: I believe in Him as King and God.


    Candidate Recites The Symbol of Faith


    I believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all
    things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the onlybegotten,
    begotten of the Father before all ages. Light of light; true God of true God;
    begotten, not made; of one essence with the Father, by Whom all things were made;
    Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate
    of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, and became man. And He was crucified for
    us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered, and was buried. And the third day He rose
    again, according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sits at the right
    hand of the Father; and He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the
    dead; Whose Kingdom shall have no end. And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the
    Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father; Who with the Father and the Son
    together is worshipped and glorified; Who spoke by the Prophets. And in one holy,
    catholic, and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of
    sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

    After the Creed, the Priest makes the following inquiry three times:
    Priest: Have you united yourself to Christ? (Three times)


    The child (or Sponsor) responds each time:
    Candidate: I have united myself to Christ.


    Priest: Bow down before Him.


    Candidate: (bowing) I bow down before the Father, and the Son, and the Holy
    Spirit, the Trinity, one in essence and undivided.


    Priest: Blessed is God, Who desirest that all men be saved and come to the
    knowledge of the truth, now and ever and unto ages of ages.


    People: Amen.


    Deacon: Let us pray to the Lord.


    People: Lord, have mercy.


    Priest: O Master, Lord our God, call Thy servant, ______, to Thy holy
    Illumination, and grant to him (her) that great grace of Thy holy
    Baptism. Put off from him (her) the old man, and renew him (her) unto
    life everlasting; and fill him (her) with the power of Thy Holy Spirit, in
    the unity of Thy Christ; that he (she) may be no more a child of the
    body, but a child of Thy Kingdom. Through the good will and grace
    of Thine Only-begotten Son, with Whom Thou art blessed, together
    with Thy most holy, good, and life-creating Spirit, now ever and unto
    ages of ages.


    People: Amen
     

    hog slayer

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    Yep, that is exactly how peter did it on Pentecost.

    Acts 2:41 | View whole chapter | See verse in contextThen they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were addedunto them about three thousand souls.

    ok. Now that was funny! And here I was trying to really dive into all that process. I'm not sure spitting on me would be appreciated(my imagination has run off woth this beyond likely reality) . Why so much exorcism?
     

    2A_Tom

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    Misunderstanding the reason for Baptism.

    Baptist doctrine in a nut shell, Win em, Wet em, and Wean em.

    Heavy on the Wean em so they can repeat.
     

    foszoe

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    ok. Now that was funny! And here I was trying to really dive into all that process. I'm not sure spitting on me would be appreciated(my imagination has run off woth this beyond likely reality) . Why so much exorcism?

    :) It is an ancient tradition that the congregation faces a certain direction when worshipping. For the Jews, I believe it was proper to face Jerusalem, for Muslims, it was to face Mecca, for the Christians it was to face east towards the Sunrise.

    As you drive around, look at old church buildings and you will see this with your own eyes. This holds true for Catholics, Protestants, and Orthodox buildings. This tendency is still in our religous DNA.

    So in the service, you are not the spitee, you are the spitter. At the direction of the priest you turn to face west, historically representening darkness. In many Churches when you face west to walk outside the nave you will see an icon of the last judgement to remind you that you are going back out to do battle with the evil one.

    Anyway, you face west and you spit upon Satan, but this spit typically lands physically on the floor/ground. Then you turn to face East symbolic again of turning your back to Satan and putting your eyes on Christ :)
     

    foszoe

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    Oh why so much exorcism....

    Ever explain anything to a teenager? Someone new on the job etc?

    It drives home that Satan is real, that the fight is real, that the danger is real. It's not just some make believe journey upon which we are about to embark.

    What's that old saying? You tell em, You tell em again etc etc something or nuther
     
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