Children...........and Guns

[bw210]

When my children are old enough to visit another friend's house, I only hope that person is responsible enough to secure their firearms. Guess, I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.

Mine already are. That is something I worry about as often as the kids visit. All we can do is hope we have taught well and pushed firearm safety so hard it won't be an issue if they do run across a firearm.

 

[Indy317]

I could careless what folks _think_ about their kids. Their kids are free thinking humans, and no amount of education, behavior modification, etc. can make them 100% obedient. I have dealt with so many parents who flat out refuse to believe their "child" (and I am talking "kids" who are 18-25 years old!) could do anything wrong. For some, if their son or daughter got a DUI, it was because they had no choice but to drive. I have known of many, many "missing persons" cases called in by frantic parents who claim their 22 year old hasn't called and "this isn't like them, something is wrong!!" when all along they are just with their girlfriend/boyfriend/friends/studying late.

If parents want to leave guns out for their kids to fondle, such is their right. The thing is, you can't stop physics, even if your kid "knows guns."

 

[Indy317]

But you telling adults that you think you know better is a little much for me to take.

I won't tell another adult that I know better than them, but then again they shouldn't expect me to bailout their ass when they screw up. I won't tell you not to smoke as long as you don't use anymore healthcare dollars than what you paid for in taxes. I won't tell you to wear a seat belt as long as you don't use any tax dollars to help pay for your injuries. Just like folks who don't wear seat belts, wear safety gear when cutting firewood, don't use jack stands and depend on just _one_ jack when working on the car, etc.. Some humans have evolved and understand risk minimization, some don't. Think of this as evolution in action.

 

[6birds]

Some humans have evolved and understand risk minimization, some don't. Think of this as evolution in action.

Ha! I wish evolution worked faster for a few around here. RNM, thanks for the OP.

 

[jeremy]

Some humans have evolved and understand risk minimization, some don't. Think of this as evolution in action.

Yup Risk Mitigation in my family starts when you are real young. We start weapons training before we are even in school...

Safes and locks are a poor substitute for education and training...

 

[smitty12b]

I guess times have really changed. My dad never locked up any of his guns and I knew at a very young age if I touched them I would be beat like a dirty rug. All my kids were taught gun safety at a very young age and knew they were not to be touched and were always loaded. They are all over 18 now so I can leave guns around the house like candles.

 

[MoparMan]

Yup Risk Mitigation in my family starts when you are real young. We start weapons training before we are even in school...

Safes and locks are a poor substitute for education and training...

Roger that!

I need my family to be able to defend themselves as well. For example, there is a story in the armed citizen section of April's American Rifleman where a 11 year old boy serious wounded a robber and scared away the other 2, in all this the boy got shot too while defending his mother and sister.

 

[IndyMonkey]

They are all over 18 now so I can leave guns around the house like candles.

 

[zekedageek]

Its all about the biometric safe! Secure and quick entry for authorized individuals.

 

[Tripp11]

I understand teaching your own children gun safety, but for those of you leaving firearms unlocked or out, how do you ensure one of your children's friends won't handle said firearm? More than 75% of my friends have never even held a firearm and they haven't taught their children any firearm safety. So, what do you all do when other children are at your house?

Not trying to start anything...just curious.

 

[Prometheus]

Like everything else it comes down to personal responsibility. The adult taking responsibility for their actions and the responsibility level of the child in question.

I personally know 8 year olds more responsible than some 17 year olds, let alone adults.

What works for a child at 12 months old may need to be changed when they are 2 years old and again at 3 and so forth...

The idea that if it's not on a hip or in a safe is asinine. Every situation is unique and the parents have the responsibility to make that decision. Hopefully they make the right one.

For my parents, they let me have my grandfathers shotgun in my room (with ammo) at 11 years old. They did keep the two handguns up, poorly as I knew where they were, but was responsible enough not to play with them.

For my wife, she had access to them from age 3 and up. She was also raised properly and with respect.

I have a 5 and 3 year old. I don't leave loaded guns around, although with my 5 1/2 year old I probably could... note probably. I'm not willing to take the responsibility of leaving it laying around and have the consequences of that action destroy my family. I'm definitely not with my chaotic 3 1/2 year old, lol! Different child. At 3 1/2 my 5 year old was shooting and had the rules down pat.

As they get older, their actions and mentality will determine what sort of access (if any) they have to them.

At a minimum I'm planning on this:

I'm not leaving my 13 and 15 y/o's home alone and completely defenseless. The above set up would also comply with the minor access to firearms laws... which I really could care less about anyway. You think you'd feel bad about your 15 y/o daughter shooting a hole in the wall, how about if she was raped and murdered at the foot of a locked gun cabinet.

Then of course you have the real variable which makes the "break glass" option all the more optimum. The childrens' friends. Aside from any peer pressure issues, some kids are nosey or thieves.

Again, it all comes down to responsibilities and consequences. No one size fits all.

Keep in mind, kids are smart. The key you hid or brilliant code to the safe isn't going to be that difficult for them to find or figure out. The best defense is a child who was raised properly and knows better.... this is especially important for when that child is visiting a friend.

 

[Spanky46151]

You are right. I've educated and exposed my kids to guns all their lives. They regard them simply as a tool, like a hammer. They know never to get out a gun without me present, I'll get up anytime and show them whatever they want to see. But I wouldn't bet their life on not making a mistake. Good point redneckmedic!

 

[ThePope]

Now waiting for someone to come along and claim that you called their child a monkey.

You are probably right, they may....BUT, it's maybe an accurate analogy if you've ever watched a small child, and a monkey, they act in some similar, simian, fashion.....

We adults act kind of the same, at times, too. ( that video on "U-Tube where the nut sets off the fire-crackers when his wife is playing around with his guns....she acts a LOT like a monkey might, even to the weird point of SNIFFING the pistol...)...

So, the analogy stands.

Ime out ........

 

[Buckhunter]

Good thread! You can never be too careful

 

[drillsgt]

Interesting thread, I have enjoyed reading it, thank RNM. Yesterday I gave about an hour long talk to graduate students about firearms issues and public health with the focus on safe storage. One of the points I made was about the subjective nature of just what "safe storage" is. It can mean different things to different people. What are some of your perceptions of safe storage? Two themes that I have noticed is one of education and trust in children not touching your guns vs. education with the necessity of locking them up. What are some other reasons that owners may not engage in "safe storage"? Cost? Safety vs. access?

 

[linzal12]

I am relieved to have found this post b/c my wife and i finally decided to cc. We are debating how to approach this with our children.

 

[Bisley Man]

When my son was crawling age I started locking up the hand guns. Now he's grown and on his own(should be the title of a song)I'M in the habit of locking ALL the guns not on my person to deter theft. I don't want to come home and be ambushed with MY OWN GUN! If I shoot him, the cops will think I planted one of my guns on him.

 

[Indysioux]

When I was a teenager, my best friend accidently shot himself through the chest with a .22 rifle (he survived and healed fully). This was someone that knew his way around guns, and was ‘generally’ very safety oriented.


He had been slowly refinishing the stock, and was still working on the sanding. He never bothered to take the gun apart. When not working on the rifle, he locked it in his gun cabinet, for which he had the only key. The first couple of times he checked the chamber, but this time he didn’t bother. He had the muzzle up against his chest when the gun went off. He had no idea where the shell came from.

Fast forward a couple of days, and his younger brother (about 13) fessed up. Apparently he had no problem picking the lock, and he had been making it a regular habit to borrow guns and go out target shooting. Normally he cleaned them afterwards (to cover his tracks), but of course, not this one time.

Check, check, and check again that the chamber is empty…

 

[HDSilvrStreak]

Good post and topic. I would like to draw an analogy as well.

For those that use the "I understood if I touched the gun, I'd be in trouble" line. (I'm also not judging). Those same rules apply to other areas of life. Some things that come to mind are tobacco, pornography, and alcohol. All are intended for adults only and should be kept away from children. I'm sure that most parents took adequate precautions to hide any porn. Yet how many of us found either our dad's or a friend's dad's stack of magazines? Did you know you weren't supposed to look? I'd also be willing to bet that most tried or experimented with alcohol before the age of 21 or borrowed a chaw or cigarette on occasion too.

Kid's know what you want to hear and that is what they will say to you. However, they also think they're invincible and that they can't get hurt because they've been taught properly. They also will look for all of you hiding placdes (those magazines weren't that hard to find).

It's just better to be safe IMO.

 

[jeremy]

Good post and topic. I would like to draw an analogy as well.

For those that use the "I understood if I touched the gun, I'd be in trouble" line. (I'm also not judging). Those same rules apply to other areas of life. Some things that come to mind are tobacco, pornography, and alcohol. All are intended for adults only and should be kept away from children. I'm sure that most parents took adequate precautions to hide any porn. Yet how many of us found either our dad's or a friend's dad's stack of magazines? Did you know you weren't supposed to look? I'd also be willing to bet that most tried or experimented with alcohol before the age of 21 or borrowed a chaw or cigarette on occasion too.

Kid's know what you want to hear and that is what they will say to you. However, they also think they're invincible and that they can't get hurt because they've been taught properly. They also will look for all of you hiding placdes (those magazines weren't that hard to find).

It's just better to be safe IMO.

Along the same lines of thought as your argument...

I'll pick 3 random items... Uhhh...
How about a chainsaw, tool sets, and kitchen knives...

There are people and children injured and killed every year with any one of these three groups than the whole of firearms.
Yet how many here lock there kitchen knives up in a safe?
Or how about your chainsaws?
Or screwdrivers?
Why not they do more harm than firearms do...

Or goodness I forgot about automobiles. Do you lock your car in a safe also? Why not it is for the safety of the children...

Makes no sense does it...