Cattle.... Upcreek

[ljk]

Yes things happen but not very often at all. Pumping out a hog house manure pit into a creek and a few cow patties dropping here and there aren't even close to being the same.

in my book few is less than 5. I'm not a farmer but I've been to few farms(4 to be exact), cows make a lot of poop in a short time and there's much you can do to stop it.

 

[jd4320t]

in my book few is less than 5. I'm not a farmer but I've been to few farms(4 to be exact), cows make a lot of poop in a short time and there's much you can do to stop it.

You didn't pay attention to the whole post. If there are a lot of cattle in one area they won't be grazing a dropping patties in a creek.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

Having some cows grazing in a field is still allowed because it doesn't impact the environment!

My guess would be that the OP won't have any real problems with his new neighbor. That will be because most farmers are good stewards of the land, are conscientious people, and want to be good neighbors. But it won't be because of any limitations on the number of cows allowed in a field. A farmer is allowed to have as many as 300 cows on a place before any kind of management plan is required.

 

[jd4320t]

My guess would be that the OP won't have any real problems with his new neighbor. That will be because most farmers are good stewards of the land, are conscientious people, and want to be good neighbors. But it won't be because of any limitations on the number of cows allowed in a field. A farmer is allowed to have as many as 300 cows on a place before any kind of management plan is required.

Do you have a link to any codes?

I know for a fact my brother in law can't put cattle back onto their cement feed lot without putting it under roof because of some new code. They had cattle on it up until 2005 or so.

Where in Indiana will you find 300 cattle in a field?

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

Do you have a link to any codes?

I know for a fact my brother in law can't put cattle back onto their cement feed lot without putting it under roof because of some new code. They had cattle on it up until 2005 or so.

Where in Indiana will you find 300 cattle in a field?

I was just quoting from an IDEM fact sheet. It says that if a farm has more than 300 cattle, then there must be an IDEM approval issued. The farm that I used to work for had 100 or so milk cows and he wasn't required to have any approval or any manure management plan.

He also had several thousand hogs and for those he was required to have an IDEM approval and a manure management plan.

I haven't talked to the guy in some years, and it's possible that other regs apply these days, other than the IDEM rules. You might have more up-dated info than I have.

 

[SMiller]

So has anyone even bothered to do some fact finding and come to the realization that grass fed beef cattle use about 1 acre per cow and there is very little poo due to the fact that they use most of what they intake.

I know no one likes facts of research but just thought I would throw it out there.

OP I think I would just be glad they didn't make me pay for half the fence that is next to your property...

 

[jd4320t]

So has anyone even bothered to do some fact finding and come to the realization that grass fed beef cattle use about 1 acre per cow and there is very little poo due to the fact that they use most of what they intake.

I know no one likes facts of research but just thought I would throw it out there.

OP I think I would just be glad they didn't make me pay for half the fence that is next to your property...

I was trying to get the point across and failed.

 

[IndyGunworks]

I am not so sure they will be 100 percent grass fed.... I believe someone else made that assumption in this thread.

 

[IndyGunworks]

Also, I understand where you guys are coming from, a lot of times the farmers do get the blame for their normal operations... more so when city people move out into the country. While I fit into that category, I didn't grow up in the city either, just didn't grow up around cattle because we bred sheep.

With that in mind, I am the one that was here first and he would be the one coming in making major changes. if it turns out to be no big deal then great no big deal. but if it cause my part of the creek to get nasty (which can and does happen) then I would like to know what my options are. and so far option number 1. would be discussing it with him.

I do appreciate all the advice and entertainment in this thread, I didn't have any idea it would cause so many emotions.

 

[singlesix]

I do appreciate all the advice and entertainment in this thread, I didn't have any idea it would cause so many emotions.

This is INGO!

 

[bwframe]

If the cattle man is bringing in a new potential environmental hazard, won't he have to get some sort of zoning or township/county approval by the neighboring or downstream property owners? Should you pursue what the county commissioners are doing in reference to this?

 

[natdscott]

Depends on the county.

-Nate

 

[bwframe]

Depends on the county.

-Nate

Also depends on how current you are on such. It might be different this year, it might be different next year. Give them long enough they'll want to have the say so.

 

[IndyGunworks]

Also depends on if any damage happens.... I don't know if anything will come of it.... I just want to know whats acceptable and whats not, and if I think its unacceptable what my courses of action can be.

 

[wagyu52]

My problem is the assumption that cattle grazing on grass is destructive and polluting the ecosystem of the creek and the surrounding land. This could not be further from the truth, Bovine have grazed grass land in perfect harmony with nature long before we domesticated them.

Overpopulation of cattle on the pasture to the point of turning it into a dirt lot would be distructive and polluting, not to mention very expensive to supplement feed them, but that has not happened yet.

Yes, if this happens your recourse is IDEM and/or DNR. As a person who HAS called them for a fish kill in a creek I can tell you they will find the problem and fine the offender. Mine was a fertilizer plant 1.5 mil away that dumped nitrogen tanted rain water.

Interestingly enough, multiple IDEM and DNR officers walked my creek and witnessed my cows being cows in the summer lounging in the water and reliving themselves, nothing was said. However, they did tell me they were Suprised at the variety and count of the fish lost and told me it was a very healthy creek and would be back to normal in a few years. IDEM deemed it an accident, poor housekeeping at the fertilizer plant, but they still fined them ($20,000) and NEVER put a dime worth of fish in the creek.

 

[wagyu52]

The DNR would be my first call. He was there within an hour and took water, soil and dead fish samples plus plenty of pictures. Also helped me get my cows off the pasture till IDEM gave us the all clear.
Took IDEM a day to show up but they did all the tech work to figure it out, they came back a dozen or so times to take water samples and look for fish repopulation. IDEM also told me when the water was safe for my cows to drink, think it was about 4 days.

This happened in 1998 so it's hard to remember the exact details but one thing I do remember is IDEM took water samples of every single drainage outlet for miles. About 2-4 houses, the fertilizer plant, a hog barn, my cattle and land applied fertilizer/pesticides were all suspected as sources.

 

[70worm]

I live around cattle farmers near Pendleton and they don't care about anything or anybody other than their cattle! You'll have to start filing pollution complaints with the state and county, and if you have any pictures of the family playing in the creek prior to the sale of the land that would great proof of previous usage. Get other neighbors involved if you can and be prepared to call the cops alot once the cattle owners find out. In my experience they're either real nice or stubburn *******s. So alot of "accidents" might happen. Your mailbox gets hit by their truck, trailer, or tractor. The cattle get through the fence in the middle of the night, stuff like that. They can be a ruthless bunch. And you better believe if your cat or dog takes one step over the property line they'll shoot'em dead. The guy down the street from me is not quite that bad but he ruined the creek for everyone downstream and then when people complaned he used his farmer/life long local resident card and the county started issuing citations to all of his neighbors that complained. Burning, unregistered vehicles in driveway, unregistered pets, mailbox to close to road, mailbox to far from the road, and on and on. If their not life long resident local guys you might win. It might just be easier to move, or buy a pool than it is to mess with the local Indiana "farm mofia" lol. And to all of those people who would call us yuppies or city slickers for complaining just ignore them. When you spend good hard earned money to buy a home and part of that home/price is the swimming/fishing hole, then someone comes along and turns it into a sewer so that they can get rich it's just not right. For all you people who feel sorry for the farmers as if they were the same farmers of the great depression era, make no mistake these people are MILLIONAIRES! I'm surrounded by them at my house most fairly nice, some pretty mean, all of them millionaires in dirty bibbed overalls.

 

[jd4320t]

Wow...just wow. You don't have a clue.

 

[natdscott]

For all you people who feel sorry for the farmers as if they were the same farmers of the great depression era, make no mistake these people are MILLIONAIRES! I'm surrounded by them at my house most fairly nice, some pretty mean, all of them millionaires in dirty bibbed overalls.

You are off base here.

I am not saying I agree or disagree with most of your post, but the above statement--particularly being that it is painted with a brush as wide as the Pacific--is not based on fact.

-Nate

 

[17 squirrel]

I live around cattle farmers near Pendleton and they don't care about anything or anybody other than their cattle! You'll have to start filing pollution complaints with the state and county, and if you have any pictures of the family playing in the creek prior to the sale of the land that would great proof of previous usage. Get other neighbors involved if you can and be prepared to call the cops alot once the cattle owners find out. In my experience they're either real nice or stubburn *******s. So alot of "accidents" might happen. Your mailbox gets hit by their truck, trailer, or tractor. The cattle get through the fence in the middle of the night, stuff like that. They can be a ruthless bunch. And you better believe if your cat or dog takes one step over the property line they'll shoot'em dead. The guy down the street from me is not quite that bad but he ruined the creek for everyone downstream and then when people complaned he used his farmer/life long local resident card and the county started issuing citations to all of his neighbors that complained. Burning, unregistered vehicles in driveway, unregistered pets, mailbox to close to road, mailbox to far from the road, and on and on. If their not life long resident local guys you might win. It might just be easier to move, or buy a pool than it is to mess with the local Indiana "farm mofia" lol. And to all of those people who would call us yuppies or city slickers for complaining just ignore them. When you spend good hard earned money to buy a home and part of that home/price is the swimming/fishing hole, then someone comes along and turns it into a sewer so that they can get rich it's just not right. For all you people who feel sorry for the farmers as if they were the same farmers of the great depression era, make no mistake these people are MILLIONAIRES! I'm surrounded by them at my house most fairly nice, some pretty mean, all of them millionaires in dirty bibbed overalls.[/QUOTE

Dam those bib wearing land barons,
Maybe you would be happier moving to a city ? Like one in MD, NYC, Cali or Wash State perhaps.
Another one that I'm glad you to are not my neighbor. Good Luck