Can we have a serious discussion of Plaxico Burress?

[Vigilant]

Stupid should hurt, hell in some cases it should be fatal! I carry my 19 "Mexican", thanks to Shay and Raven Concealment, but NOT in sweats. I disagree with NYC laws, no, I think, I disagree with NYC in general. That does not change the fact that the man is an idiot for what he did. He makes more money on Sunday afternoon, than I make in probably half a year, so, LEGAL security was and is available to him whether it be a BG, an attorney to "grease" the way through the NYC permit process, or a proper carry rig for whatever "fashion" he chose to sport at da club that night. So I find it hard to stand by him, (judging from the incident, I daresay, I don't want to stand anywhere NEAR him), and as far as our rights go, I'll stand behind most anyone, including former felons to a point.

 

[ATM]

If I do nothing to help him defeat these unconstitutional laws, then I tacitly approve of such laws. By being silent I help the lawmakers who pass unconstitutional laws.

I do not approve of such laws.

Remove him from that sentence and it stands. He did nothing to help defeat these laws. He gave more fuel to the fire to strengthen and solidify the antis position that we need these and more laws for public safety. I can't stand with or anywhere near him as we work to undo that with which we disapprove.

 

[10ring]

He was carrying a Glock. He carried it in the waistband of his sweat pants, no holster/Mexican style. It fell, he grabbed for it, one of his fingers hit the trigger and fired the gun. He's an idiot.

I figured he was carrying mexican.

 

[jeremy]

How about the Mayor of NYC walk around "his" city without his bodyguards for a month and see what his stance on firearms is after that?

 

[indytechnerd]

Support Plaxico Burress = no. Regardless of your constitutional right, I will not stand beside you if you are being a dumbass.

Plaxico's Contract - Plaxico Burress
$100k bonus for each game he is active. That means that his 'bonus' for showing up each week, regardless of how much he actually plays, is more than I make in a year.

Executive Protection and Personal Security Guard Services - This site was the 2nd link in a google search for "new york city private security", not real difficult to get a couple suits to follow you around for the evening.

 

[kludge]

My opinion...

If a city can ban law-abiding citizens the means to protect themselves, then the individual (or his heirs) can sue the city for failure to protect him.

 

[Zoub]

But the core of this situation really is that Plaxico Burress is going to go to jail because the New York laws prevented him from legally obtaining a permit to protect himself.

He is going to jail because he conciously chose to break the law. The law of a state he chose to live in. There are other teams in the NFL, he found himself drawn to NYC? Why? Perhaps the lifestyle? It sure as hell ain't no Green Bay or Pittsburgh.

I have family in The Bronx, I choose to never live there. I love Wisconsin, probably will never live there either. Up until lately I was not a big fan of Ohio and why live in Illinois? I did my time in Los Angeles, no need to go back there.

I vote with my income, tax dollars, business activites, land purchases and leisure time money.

Plus he knows he is a high profile individual. He broke gun laws. He makes us look bad when does that, even if the laws he breaks are bad.

 

[melensdad]

OK maybe I misphrased everything in this thread. But I don't think we need to support Mr Burress, but I do think we need to oppose the laws that will throw him in jail for a MANDATORY MINIMUM of 3.5 YEARS.

While I think Burress is a bid idiot, and while I think he makes people with carry permits look bad, I don't think, however we need to throw this case under the bus simply because he is an idiot.

 

[USMC_0311]

Yes Plexico was stupid. What if starting Jan 1 2009 Indiana went no licensed carry. How many of you would still carry? Would you conciously choose to break the law if YOUR rights were being ignored?
I think thats what melensdad is getting at. Remove Plexico from the situtation and you have an otherwise normal law abidding citizen that wants to defend themselves. I don't know the process to get a licenes in NY but obviously its not easy, what if he applied and got turned down for no good reason? If NY laws were similar to IN laws then all we would talking about is a stupid professional athlete that shot him self. No crime committed

 

[Cwood]

I see it this way. He could not legally carry a gun in NYC. Is that right, no but that is what the current law is. Did he have security available to him is he thought he was going to need it? Yes, each NFL team has a security officer with can provide off duty local LEO to the players for their protection. He chose not to follow the law and carry a gun illegally when he had other choices.

I can not stand up for a man that does not follow the law and then thinks that nothing should happen to him. He by definition is not a responsible gun owner, he makes us all look bad!

The laws in NYC and NY state need to be changed this I to believe.

 

[waloidian]

his situation doesn't warrant much sympathy, because he has shown a pattern of irresponsible and selfish behavior...while not legally related, he is a terrible role model to kids, and his actions BEFORE the shooting are well documented.

 

[dburkhead]

My official position on Plaxico Burress

As much as an individual can have an "official position."

Plaxico Burress is a horrible example of gun owners and people who carry. What he did, and how he did it was stupid and irresponsible. The problem is in places like New York where it is nearly impossible for ordinary people to carry guns, all you have are the stupid, the irresponsible, and the criminal. This presents a false picture of gun owners. Places with more liberal gun laws, places like Vermont, Alaska, and, yes, Indiana, do not have significantly more such incidents per capita. What this shows is that even in places with strict gun laws you are going to have the occassional stupid irresponsible criminal action. The gun laws only restrict those who aren't stupid, irrepsonsible, or careless.

 

[undecided]

I think him doing time for having an illegal handgun is stupid but I do think he should be punished in some way for public endangerment due to his irresponsible handling of a firearm.

 

[MilitaryArms]

What if it was Eli Manning? Joe Namath? Arnold Palmer? Tom Selleck? Or any other 'respectable' celebrity or sports figure? Are you tossing Plaxico under the bus because he is a big black gangsta type football player who is simply not a role model for respectable gun owners?

No, I am tossing him under the bus because he broke the law. Right or wrong, NY does not allow people to carry concealed. If you can't live with that law, leave. There are 38 other states where you can legally carry a concealed weapon.

As for his being Black, why would you imply anyone here is opposed to his actions because of his race? That's kind of rude, don't you think? You can make your point without calling us all racists I think.

The legality of the law will be vetted in court. Meanwhile, we (you and I) don't get to pick which laws we abide by and which laws we disregard.

If anything, he's done more damage to our rights because he's brought concealed carry to the forefront of the news in a bad way. 1) illegally carrying and 2) does something stupid and shoots himself.

Someone on the fence regarding legal carry would be turned off by this story.

Good luck getting the NRA to touch this mess with a 10ft pole. Not only are they generally inept as a gun rights organization, they're not real keen on helping citizens out of jams like this. If the NRA wanted to do something useful for gun owners, they should have jumped in with both feet on the David Olofson case... but they didn't. Now anyone with a semi-auto rifle stands to do prison time if their gun malfunctions.

 

[singlestacksig]

He was carrying a Glock. He carried it in the waistband of his sweat pants, no holster/Mexican style. It fell, he grabbed for it, one of his fingers hit the trigger and fired the gun. He's an idiot.

But

I do not care what his lifestyle is.
I do not care how much money he makes, so long as it is earned legally.
I do not care that he is a "jerk". There's no law against being a jerk.

What I do care about is that he has been charged with breaking unconstitutional laws.

If I do nothing to help him defeat these unconstitutional laws, then I tacitly approve of such laws. By being silent I help the lawmakers who pass unconstitutional laws.

I do not approve of such laws.

If he has used a proper holster no one would hve known and he would have not ben in trouble...

 

[indyjoe]

I think it is more important to support someone who is a responsible gun owner, but could not get a permit and was attacked and killed. I'm sure it has happened and it would we a much better spokes model than Burris.

 

[IUGradStudent]

I'm actually with Melensdad on this one. I think Plaxico Burgess was stupid in the way he did it, but remember what he's going to get prosecuted for--carrying a handgun for self-defense. He carried a handgun, which is his constitutional right, and he's (probably) going to go to jail for it. That's wrong.

Here's David Kopel in WSJ today: Free Plaxico Burress - WSJ.com

The intro:

New York Giants star receiver Plaxico Burress is facing a mandatory 3½ years in prison and the end of his football career. His crime? Not having a license, which New York City never would have issued him, for the exercise of his constitutional right to bear arms. To be sure, Mr. Burress got caught because of what appears to have been stupid and irresponsible behavior connected with the handgun. But he does not face prison for shooting himself. His impending mandatory sentence highlights the unfairness and unconstitutionality of New York City's draconian gun laws.

 

[indyjoe]

The interesting thing here is that Burress has enough money to fight this and the only real grounds they can fight are using the 2nd Amendment.

 

[bcbz71]

Gives gun owners a bad name....

 

[MinuteManMike]

I have no use for the man or his stupidity. But his "punishment" should be limited to the physical damage he did to himself.

Not being properly deferential to the state of NY shouldn't be a crime.

Of course, I think convicted felons should be allowed to legally carry too so feel free to dismiss me as a lunatic.