Can Democracy Survive The “Defenders Of Democracy”?

[Ingomike]

A great read here by most likely one of the most even handed constitutional scholars of our time. I don’t always agree with him but always respect his insight.

Can Democracy Survive the “Defenders of Democracy”?

Below is my column in The Hill on the latest calls to protect democracy with distinctly undemocratic measures. Former presidential candidate Hillary Clinton insisted that the 2024 election was our …

jonathanturley.org

If you are interested in seeing more of his work it is here.

JONATHAN TURLEY

Res ipsa loquitur - The thing itself speaks

jonathanturley.org

 

[loudgroove]

I've never understood why they say they want to save democracy when they are pushing socialism (A.K.A. communism with them in charge).

 

[racegunz]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

 

[loudgroove]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

Dems always call it democracy and most republicans calls it a republic. Go figure that one out. lol

 

[Twangbanger]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

They're very clear on their definition. They mean every breathing thing gets a ballot, whether constitutionally provided for or not.

 

[Ingomike]

I've never understood why they lie

FIFY

 

[Ingomike]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

I think we are a democratic constitutional republic that the people weakened with the 17th amendment…

 

[INPatriot]

I've never understood why they say they want to save democracy when they are pushing socialism (A.K.A. communism with them in charge).

It's the only way they can continue to control the ignorant elements of their voting bloc.

 

[INPatriot]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

Easy now, there are some on INGO that believe the semantics don't matter either.

 

[Shadow01]

I've never understood why they say they want to save democracy when they are pushing socialism (A.K.A. communism with them in charge).

Because you are looking at it logically

 

[Shadow01]

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

If they call it a “democracy “ long enough, then the stooges that support the dems will think and demand a true democracy.

 

[Leadeye]

It means something else to those people, DDR was the German Democratic republic, where it's even in the name.

East Germany, led by such egalitarian luminaries as Eric Honecker and Walter Ulbricht.



Democratic Kampuchea was run by another paragon of equality, Pol Pot. Everybody got equal under his democratic leadership, dead.




"When I use a word,it means just what I choose it to mean."

 

[Timjoebillybob]

A great read here by most likely one of the most even handed constitutional scholars of our time. I don’t always agree with him but always respect his insight.

Can Democracy Survive the “Defenders of Democracy”?

Below is my column in The Hill on the latest calls to protect democracy with distinctly undemocratic measures. Former presidential candidate Hillary Clinton insisted that the 2024 election was our …

jonathanturley.org

If you are interested in seeing more of his work it is here.

JONATHAN TURLEY

Res ipsa loquitur - The thing itself speaks

jonathanturley.org

Another good one is Alan Dershowitz, flaming liberal but he usually doesn't let his personal beliefs interfere with his legal takes, except for the 2nd Am. On that he's a straight up dumpster fire.

Ahhhhhhhh! Our form of government is a constitutional republic, why can’t these talking heads get it right ? Or is it on purpose? Maybe they think that the populace is to ignorant to know the difference?
Either way I think it’s already a lost cause.

What if I told you it was both? Republic simply means a country not ruled by royalty, kings, queens, emperors, etc.

We are a Constitutional democratic representative republic.

It means something else to those people, DDR was the German Democratic republic, where it's even in the name.

East Germany, led by such egalitarian luminaries as Eric Honecker and Walter Ulbricht.

View attachment 358404

Democratic Kampuchea was run by another paragon of equality, Pol Pot. Everybody got equal under his democratic leadership, dead.

View attachment 358403


"When I use a word,it means just what I choose it to mean."

Don't forget the Democratic Republic of (N) Korea, the old USSR, the Peoples Republic of China, etc. All of which in fact meet the definition of "Republic".

If they call it a “democracy “ long enough, then the stooges that support the dems will think and demand a true democracy.

What do you mean by "true democracy "?

 

[Shadow01]

Another good one is Alan Dershowitz, flaming liberal but he usually doesn't let his personal beliefs interfere with his legal takes, except for the 2nd Am. On that he's a straight up dumpster fire.


What if I told you it was both? Republic simply means a country not ruled by royalty, kings, queens, emperors, etc.

We are a Constitutional democratic representative republic.


Don't forget the Democratic Republic of (N) Korea, the old USSR, the Peoples Republic of China, etc. All of which in fact meet the definition of "Republic".


What do you mean by "true democracy "?

Majority vote wins. no representatives

 

[racegunz]

Another good one is Alan Dershowitz, flaming liberal but he usually doesn't let his personal beliefs interfere with his legal takes, except for the 2nd Am. On that he's a straight up dumpster fire.


What if I told you it was both? Republic simply means a country not ruled by royalty, kings, queens, emperors, etc.

We are a Constitutional democratic representative republic.


Don't forget the Democratic Republic of (N) Korea, the old USSR, the Peoples Republic of China, etc. All of which in fact meet the definition of "Republic".


What do you mean by "true democracy "?

Yes I know and understand thx though for clarification. There are many “forms” of democracy, but of course you know that.

 

[racegunz]

Majority vote wins. no representatives

Yes the worst form of democracy possible, basically mob rule.

 

[Tombs]

I've never understood why they say they want to save democracy when they are pushing socialism (A.K.A. communism with them in charge).

They aren't even advocating that. Notice they aren't implementing price controls to deal with inflation. They aren't really propping up unions in megacorps that are donating to their campaigns. They aren't seeking to improve quality of living for the poor or low middle class.

It's not socialism they're pursuing. It's an oligarchy, and they're chasing the dream of making sure they can never be held accountable for it, and pave the way for their continued power.

They are doing everything possible to ensure they can comfortably live in their own little bubble, and never have to answer to the people in any capacity. That isn't socialism or communism. The wealth redistribution involved is only going to the most powerful and largest corporations in the country.

Also a democratic republic means you have representatives you vote for, to represent you in government. A straight democracy would be the people running a straight popular vote on every issue, which is mob rule. The latter is what the DNC wants to turn the country into. Because it's far easier and cheaper to run TV ads and media to mass brainwash people than it is to control every single election and every single representative.

The 17th amendment represented a reduction in the "republic" aspect of our "democratic republic."

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Majority vote wins. no representatives

So a direct democracy.

Yes the worst form of democracy possible, basically mob rule.

We have mob rule now. Just representative mob rule.

The 17th amendment represented a reduction in the "republic" aspect of our "democratic republic."

I agree with your post with the exception of this. It didn't reduce our republic aspect of our govt. It didn't create a monarchy. If anything depending on which definition it actually enhanced it.

Definition of REPUBLIC

a government having a chief of state who is not a monarch and who in modern times is usually a president; a political unit (such as a nation) having such a form of government… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

Under 1a, no change. 1b it made our govt even more of a republic.

I will agree that it harmed how our govt was intended to be. But even without that amendment we'd most likely be in the same place. By the time it was ratified iirc 30+ states already had defacto direct elections for senators.

 

[Tombs]

I agree with your post with the exception of this. It didn't reduce our republic aspect of our govt. It didn't create a monarchy. If anything depending on which definition it actually enhanced it.

Definition of REPUBLIC

a government having a chief of state who is not a monarch and who in modern times is usually a president; a political unit (such as a nation) having such a form of government… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

Under 1a, no change. 1b it made our govt even more of a republic.

I will agree that it harmed how our govt was intended to be. But even without that amendment we'd most likely be in the same place. By the time it was ratified iirc 30+ states already had defacto direct elections for senators.

I see your argument, but what I'm saying is that permitting more voting for more things, is fundamentally inching further towards democracy rather than a democratic republic.

Limiting voting to a much smaller subset of the population, and keeping direct voting for reps to a state or township level, would do wonders for reverting us back to how this country is intended to function.

 

[Ingomike]

CNN Freaks Out Over MAGA Republicans Calling US a 'Republic'—and the Big Problem This Exposes

redstate.com