Best pistol cartridge/rifle combo for IN deer?

[jim7310]

My deer hunting in IN in the past has been limited to muzzle loader and some slug hunting. I hunt in other northern and western states with a variety of high-power riffles. I now want to hunt the IN firearms season more seriously and would like to get a rifle, chambered in a pistol cartridge, just for hunting here. The problem is, which rifle and which cartridge?

The .44 Mag and .44 LC in lever guns are everywhere. I have a TC Encore that I use quite a bit, and could just add a barrel, but am leaning away from a single-shot for this gun. I love lever guns, although an autoloader would be fine as well. I also would like to wring out as much power and range as can be safely done from a pistol cartridge in a carbine - hence my uncertainty as to cartridge choice. I hand load, so I am not worried about being able to get the full potential out of whatever cartridge I choose.

I need some advice from you folks with experience, please let me know what you like and what works for you.

Jim

 

[snapping turtle]

357 max gives you the range and power. 200 yard gun. just need dies a barrel and brass.

 

[VERT]

I would add the encore barrel if I were you. I hunt with a .357 Marlin 1894c. It is a fun gun to shoot and hunt with. The .357 kills deer fine, but for a dedicated deer gun I would go with the .44.

 

[fireball168]

I also would like to wring out as much power and range as can be safely done from a pistol cartridge in a carbine - hence my uncertainty as to cartridge choice.

I hand load, so I am not worried about being able to get the full potential out of whatever cartridge I choose.

Here you go, Encore barrels are in stock.

358 BFG WSSM

 

[mwilson]

give fireball a call about his 358bfg barrels fot the encore. while mine is not his barrel it is the same calibre. the dies and brass are his. these things are easy 200 yard guns, 300 if youll practice enough.

 

[M4Madness]

Since you mentioned handloading, the .358 WSSM should win hands down.

 

[jim7310]

Thanks for the info on the .358 WSSM; it looks to be an interesting cartridge design. However, I think that I would rather go with a repeater for this rifle, and a factory chambering as it may be loaned out on occasion. Jim

 

[M4Madness]

By "repeater", do you mean semi-auto, or some sort of lever-action, etc.?

My wife had a semi-auto Ruger 99/44 Deerfield Carbine in .44 Magnum, until she traded it in earlier this month for a bolt-action Ruger 77/44.

I personally prefer an AR-15 chambered in .458 SOCOM. AR-15 rifles can also be chambered in the .358 WSSM, and if the case length extension is passed for next year's deer season, you'll also be able to deer hunt with AR-15 rifles chambered in .450 Bushmaster and .50 Beowulf.

 

[Redskinsfan]

I bought a Puma '92 in 454 for my son. The 454 may give the extended range beyond the 44 magnum a bit.

We shoot only 45LC in the 454 as we have not sensed any need for more power or range.

Have fun finding your new gun.

Terry

 

[Hawkeye]

Is there really a true need for more than ~ 150 yards for deer in indiana? I would think the .357 Mag/.45LC/.44 Mag would be adequate for 99% of us. My concern with some of the comments about longer and longer ranges shots is the flatness of the terrain, again in general.

 

[RelicHound]

Is there really a true need for more than ~ 150 yards for deer in indiana? I would think the .357 Mag/.45LC/.44 Mag would be adequate for 99% of us. My concern with some of the comments about longer and longer ranges shots is the flatness of the terrain, again in general.

I dont know about the northern part of the state but down here I have no need for a 100-200+ yard gun. on average Id say most of the deer I have taken have been under 50yards.

 

[jim7310]

You know, in over 30 years of deer hunting I can count the number of deer I have taken at distances beyond 200 yds on one hand (with some fingers left); including hunting regularly in a wide open state like Kansas. The vast majority have been taken between 50 and 100 yds. My concern has always been with accurate shot placement with a heavy enough bullet to penetrate at range and kill cleanly. I have favored large-bore cartridges pushing heavy bullets at moderate velocities.

After hearing folks so far and doing some research it seems to come down to a lever gun in 44mag, 45LC or 454. The 480 ruger looked interesting but seems unavailable now. So, of the three 44/45s - does any one have a significant advantage?

Jim

 

[WLW]

You know, in over 30 years of deer hunting I can count the number of deer I have taken at distances beyond 200 yds on one hand (with some fingers left); including hunting regularly in a wide open state like Kansas. The vast majority have been taken between 50 and 100 yds. My concern has always been with accurate shot placement with a heavy enough bullet to penetrate at range and kill cleanly. I have favored large-bore cartridges pushing heavy bullets at moderate velocities.

After hearing folks so far and doing some research it seems to come down to a lever gun in 44mag, 45LC or 454. The 480 ruger looked interesting but seems unavailable now. So, of the three 44/45s - does any one have a significant advantage?

Jim

I would have to agree with your assessment on long distance kills. I've hunted a great deal in Texas and we all know that can be wide open country. Longest deer shot there was 150 yards. Here I took a buck at 130 yards (slug since pistol cartridges weren't approved yet). The Indiana buck was rare because every deer I've taken since then has been under 100 yards with the vast majority somewhere around 50 yards +/-.

When pistol cartridges were approved I moved to a Marlin .44 Mag and scoped it. I regret doing that as I a shot under a buck last seaon because it was too close! I'm transitioning the gun to a set of Weaver peep sights.

So... I can't brag about the .44 yet, but I think you would be fine with a .44 and the loading possibilities are pretty vast. Just keep in mind that Marlin set the twist rate to 1:38 where as the 45LC is 1:16. It drives me batty as to while Marlin does that... so your use of a bullet larger than 265 grains is probably not going to provide results you are happy with. Just something to factor in for your decision. I actually was shopping for a a 45LC Marlin but could not find one before deer season. I wanted the faster twist rate.

Just some rambling thoughts...

 

[indyjoe]

I really like the XS Ghost Ring sights on my 1894 Marlin .44 Mag. They also have a scout scope mount that allows you to use the sights with the scope removed. This would be great with a 1.5-2x pistol or scout scope on it for quick acquisition.

Although, I've found I'm minute of deer with the Ghost ring out past 100 yards.

I'm considering getting a decent red dot for my S&W .44 Mag 629 so I have the choice between Marlin or Revolver.

 

[kludge]

After hearing folks so far and doing some research it seems to come down to a lever gun in 44mag, 45LC or 454. The 480 ruger looked interesting but seems unavailable now. So, of the three 44/45s - does any one have a significant advantage?

Jim

Standard pressure .45 Colt is plenty for deer. In most modern lever actions (I say most just in case "all" is not true) you can load "Ruger-T/C" handloads that will get you a near equivalent to a .44 Magnum.

In a practical sense, within 100 yards, the .454 Casull doesn't have a "significant" advantage for deer hunting. I mean, if a standard pressure .45 Colt will put a bullet through both sides of a deer, what more is a .454 going to do? Put the same size hole though the deer faster?

That said, the advantage of the .454 Casull over the .45 Colt is trajectory and energy at longer ranges.

Out of a rifle you can probably get 1400-1500fps from the Colt (with Ruger loads and a 240-250gr bullet). With the .454 you can get close to 2000 fps. I get 1600+ fps with a 300gr XTP-Mag from my 9.5" Ruger SRH, and 1725+ fps with a 240gr.

 

[rugernut65]

they also make a barrel in .44mag for your encore i thought about getting one BUT i already have 44s i 77/44 and a 1894 and a 1894c in 357 so......momma wont let me get one lol

 

[jim7310]

I too am a big fan of the XS sights - I use them and the Ashley Outdoors scout mount on my Marlin 1895 and have never looked back. I am amazed at how fast I can acquire a target with that ghost ring and the accuracy is surprisingly good. The XS sight is also super durable and makes me feel much more confident then the peep sight I had installed before.

Well, as things narrow down it seems that the .44 mag is coming out on top in the popularity contest. It makes sense too in that it is pretty easy to stop in pretty much any place that sells ammo and buy a box of .44 mag ammo if necessary. I love Marlin lever action rifles, but the slow twist is a deal-killer for me - I like big fat cast bullets.

What do you all think of the other .44 lever guns out on the market now? The Puma? (I don't really like Ruger's wierd lever gun) The Rossi? Others?

 

[Hawkeye]

I really like the XS Ghost Ring sights on my 1894 Marlin .44 Mag. They also have a scout scope mount that allows you to use the sights with the scope removed. This would be great with a 1.5-2x pistol or scout scope on it for quick acquisition.

Although, I've found I'm minute of deer with the Ghost ring out past 100 yards.

I'm considering getting a decent red dot for my S&W .44 Mag 629 so I have the choice between Marlin or Revolver.

That's how I have my Wichester Trapper set up - Ghost Rings and Scout Scope. Thinking of Ghost Rings for my 77/44 too.

 

[x10]

+1 on 44 mag, I have been living the pistol cart. life since they made it legal, I used the pistol for years, then lever gun now a Ruger 77/44 bolt action. I hunt heavy woods and rarely the open fields, the 44 has bullet diameter which I feel is manditory for getting blood out of a deer. I'm not a 357mag/max fan, I've seen heavy winter coats and fat plug up the 357 holes and make it hard to track. the high powered 35 cal bullets are different.

Plus you can pick up ammo about anywhere for 44 mag so if you have a disaster and you loose your ammo you can be back up and running with a trip to the store. There has been alot of development in the 44 bullets for game and it has paid off, No other cart. can you stop by 9 out of 10 places that sell ammo (beside 357 mag) can you be ensured of ammo

Also I use a red dot sight on the pistol AND the rifle

 

[indyjoe]

Also I use a red dot sight on the pistol AND the rifle

I hadn't thought about that for the rifle, but with a scout mount, I bet you could set it up so the ghost ring sights would be fine seeing through the red dot with dead batteries. Another interesting option. Hmmm.