Baofeng 2nd gen or 3rd gen?

[Cameramonkey]

Picked up a BF-F8+ today. (Well, more accurately, the gentleman in brown gave it to me today after ordering it Monday from Amazon) Going for my technician license eventually, but just wanted something to play with for now to listen in and possibly use for the public spectrum like FRS. (For a bonus, the antenna/receiver is pretty awesome. I was able to listen clearly to WIBC in my office which I have never been able to do with any standard FM radio. So even if I abandon this as a HAM platform it has a home on my desk at work at least)

I started my quest looking at the BF-F8HP and UV-82HP, but at half the cost (because its no longer made) I couldnt resist the + for my first. (I was able to get the radio plus accessories for the virtually the same cost as just the newer ones.)

So here's the question. Are the two newer ones worth the extra money? Worth double the money? I understand they are 7/8 vs 4/5 watts. But I like the visibility of the UV's color options. Im famous for dropping crap and losing it. Brightly colored objects are my friend.

Would the extra couple watts (yes, I have seen I can only use 7 of the 8 in the US) be of benefit? Especially in a SHTF scenario where the FCC is no longer a factor. A better PCB and more power is the biggest difference I can see between the generations.

My most common use would be at our vacation house where I need to reach up to 1 1/4 mile NLOS with only a bit of trees between the two points. (mostly open air) I suspect MURS would do that but am pretty sure FRS/GMRS cant quite.


So what says the INGO HAMs?

What would you say is the better of the two if its down to the new radios? Other than style, I dont see much difference.

 

[foszoe]

Its logarithmic. Going from 1 watt to 2 gains 3db signal strength. 2 to 4 gets 3 db more, 4 to 8 gets 3db more, 8 to 16 gets 3 db more. An S unit is about 6 db. So doubling power yields about half an s unit on your signal strength meter

For SHTF scenarios, focus on antennas more than watts. Especially on your hand held.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Exactly, thats why its not a slam dunk Foszoe. It was explained to me that each watt is only a quarter increase in distance. (so in the most basic description using easy math if I am getting 1 mile at 1 watt, going to 2 watts would get me 1 1/4 miles, not 2 miles.) I do know enough from my limited reading its all about the size. Going better quality/bigger/higher will yield the most distance improvements. But I am starting my comparison as apples to apples as I can, by concentrating strictly on the handheld itself. I can apply the same antenna improvements to all.

And as for size, they are all physically the same size and weight. Another muddying of the water. For SHTF, I do see the advantage of less transmit power = longer battery life.

I was also wondering if there was something more subtle I was missing. For instance I did see an anecdote that the more expensive ones have louder speakers.

 

[AngryRooster]

This sums it up pretty well for the Baofeng radios. The Miklor site has lots of good information on them.
UV82HP Review, Miklor


I normally avoid ARFCOM like the plaque, way too much drama, BS & attitude. However, the ham radio section is quite a bit different. Very large, active and full of information & good people. It's hard to believe that it's really part of ARFCOM. Here is the main ham link.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/f_10/22_Ham_Radios.html&page=1


Inside that link there are several threads on the various Baofeng radios. This one pretty much asks the same question you just did.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_10_22/686753_Baofeng__.html


There are a few members from Indiana on the ARFCOM site, some are members here on INGO, some are not. There's a a multipage Indiana Ham Campout event that's being discussed, not sure if it's happened yet or not. Lots of good information and enough reading to keep you busy for a while.


Sailor will probably be along shortly to offer some advise as well.


You will want these as well:
Indiana Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference
Central Indiana Skywarn repeaters | Central Indiana Skywarn
https://www.repeaterbook.com/repeaters/index.php?state_id=18
W9ICE ham amateur radio club experimenters repeater vhf contest indianapolis carmel indiana irlp ice D-Star
Indiana - Scanner Frequencies - Phone Numbers - IP Addresses



If you decide you want something much more sturdy and versatle in the future then take a look at the Yaesu FT-60. About $150 in price, much better built, better battery options, 1k memory with groups, weather alert, etc. I have several of the little Baofengs, they have their place, but my go-to radio is the FT-60.




Edit to add:
Forgot to mention that ARFCOM has a weekly Echolink net every Friday once you get your license.

 

[foszoe]

A great shtf radio is a Yaesu 817. With that radio, 5 watts and a wire dipole at my house, I have used PSK on a laptop and talked with ease all over the us. WITH 30 watts, I have talked to Japan, Greece and South America (using PSK31)

 

[Spear Dane]

I would say no, Cameramonkey. I started out with the 5, got an 82 when my 5 was stolen but they still sell them and I would have no issues buying another if it was my only option. For the money, they are simply the best value in ham history. And I will second what foszoe said and urge you to go on immediately to get your General at least. The 817 is indeed about the pinnacle of SHTF radios, it's what's called a 'shack in the box' in that you got all the HF up into 2 meter at least plus general receive. Yeah a used one will run several hundred bucks...but if comms apres apocalypse is a thing for you, that's your radio.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Thanks guys. Have I mentioned lately how much INGO rocks?

 

[foszoe]

Exactly, thats why its not a slam dunk Foszoe. It was explained to me that each watt is only a quarter increase in distance. (so in the most basic description using easy math if I am getting 1 mile at 1 watt, going to 2 watts would get me 1 1/4 miles, not 2 miles.) I do know enough from my limited reading its all about the size. Going better quality/bigger/higher will yield the most distance improvements. But I am starting my comparison as apples to apples as I can, by concentrating strictly on the handheld itself. I can apply the same antenna improvements to all.

And as for size, they are all physically the same size and weight. Another muddying of the water. For SHTF, I do see the advantage of less transmit power = longer battery life.

I was also wondering if there was something more subtle I was missing. For instance I did see an anecdote that the more expensive ones have louder speakers.

For me, I would be happy with the one you have. I have 2 Baofengs. My Icom 92 and yaesu vx8dr are more capable AND more expensive. I keep the Baofengs in the car and for my wife and I to carry when we are out. Cheap and easy to use. Thats kind of where I am envisioning you are.

When the state fair stage collapsed and I told my wife to run and dart into a building in front of me, the sight of all those people holding up phones made quite an impression. They had no comms, we did. Baofengs are fine for that.

One thing though, the baofeng SMA antenna connections are opposite of most after market antennas. Which is what most people upgrade first.

Sorry if messages are curt or not helpful. At work and on phone so it's hard to see and respond in depth.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Funny thing, Rooster? I had no Idea my company's techs were running licensed radios. Just stumbled across them on your link to Indiana scanner frequencies.

 

[Cameramonkey]

You are more than helpful Foszoe. To the point and lots of useful info. No worries.

 

[AngryRooster]

Funny thing, Rooster? I had no Idea my company's techs were running licensed radios. Just stumbled across them on your link to Indiana scanner frequencies.

When I worked in a factory I carried my little Yaesu VX3 (very small, think old school pager) with our companies frequencies loaded into it. I could listen in to the forklift drivers, the office, security, big wigs, etc.

That's one of the nice things about the Yaesu radios over the Baofengs. They have a much broader receive capability. Aircraft, trains, business, race tracks, etc. That 127 memory bank fills up pretty quick.

 

[caverjamie]

One thing to keep in mind about the Baofeng radios is that you get what you pay for. Some..well about half of them did not fall within the specifications for a part 97 radio when tested. Here is a link to the article I read about it:

http://wp.ni4ce.org/wp-content/uploads/qst.pdf

I haven't heard any complaints about their function, and the price can't be beat, just something to be aware of.

 

[Dorky_D]

I got the higher power one. I figured at only $60, it was still pretty cheap. It might have a bit more capability. I am not licensed and I do not know a ton about them. I went through Sailor's class, so I know a bit. I figure $30 is not really that much more.
this https://www.amazon.com/BaoFeng-BF-F...e=UTF8&qid=1471663665&sr=1-3&keywords=baofeng

 

[robbman]

I purchased one and it is okay for the price. There seems to be an abundance of these cheap Chinese radios but the quality isn't even close to that of my icom.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I got the higher power one. I figured at only $60, it was still pretty cheap. It might have a bit more capability. I am not licensed and I do not know a ton about them. I went through Sailor's class, so I know a bit. I figure $30 is not really that much more.
this https://www.amazon.com/BaoFeng-BF-F...e=UTF8&qid=1471663665&sr=1-3&keywords=baofeng

Yeah, $30 is $30, but its still DOUBLE the price of the older model. Thats a mighty steep percentage. If it were only $15 or $20 more it wouldnt be that big of a deal and I'd pounce. And the features dont seem to be much more. Just newer design with a bigger transmitter. If I can get what I need for $30, why pay $60?

I purchased one and it is okay for the price. There seems to be an abundance of these cheap Chinese radios but the quality isn't even close to that of my icom.

Agreed, nobody is claiming super quality. Icoms are awesome. But I wont cry if I drop a Baofeng on the concrete or in a creek.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Thanks for everyone's input. I just pulled the trigger on my 2nd +. In the end I just couldnt see paying double the cost for no more features.

I may buy an ICOM or something fancy if I get into the hobby, but for now I think these will work.

And if I want blue, Problem solved. Thanks China!

2X Blue Rubber Handheld Case Cover Holster for BAOFENG UV5R UV 5RA UV 5RB UV 5RC | eBay

 

[foszoe]

Thanks for everyone's input. I just pulled the trigger on my 2nd +. In the end I just couldnt see paying double the cost for no more features.

I may buy an ICOM or something fancy if I get into the hobby, but for now I think these will work.

And if I want blue, Problem solved. Thanks China!

2X Blue Rubber Handheld Case Cover Holster for BAOFENG UV5R UV 5RA UV 5RB UV 5RC | eBay

You have made the right choice

 

[Cameramonkey]

Oh, and it was really cool listening in on the skywarn guys keeping an eye on the minor storm that rolled through here today. Nothing juicy of course because it was simply a squall line, but still interesting.

(now I just need to figure out how to disable TX per memory channel, instead of the whole radio. Everything trick I found so far makes CHIRP freak out)

 

[AngryRooster]

It's been a while since I've used CHIRP but I know there is a way to do it. I have the scanner channels locked out on mine (police, fire, ambulance, etc).

The skywarn guys are really good and much more informative than the regular broadcasts. The other day when the tornadoes rolled through was really interesting. It's so much better to hear "I'm at 900W and 600N and the funnel just touched the ground." instead of the usual stuff. Especially if you live on one of those roads. Also got to hear then give out a warning about one of the news casters and his crew running around. I think it was Chuck Lofton's crew that was racing around at 70 MPH on the county roads. Wonderful time to be in an accident.

 

[GLOCKMAN23C]

Oh, and it was really cool listening in on the skywarn guys keeping an eye on the minor storm that rolled through here today. Nothing juicy of course because it was simply a squall line, but still interesting.

(now I just need to figure out how to disable TX per memory channel, instead of the whole radio. Everything trick I found so far makes CHIRP freak out)

It's been a while since I've used CHIRP but I know there is a way to do it. I have the scanner channels locked out on mine (police, fire, ambulance, etc).

The skywarn guys are really good and much more informative than the regular broadcasts. The other day when the tornadoes rolled through was really interesting. It's so much better to hear "I'm at 900W and 600N and the funnel just touched the ground." instead of the usual stuff. Especially if you live on one of those roads. Also got to hear then give out a warning about one of the news casters and his crew running around. I think it was Chuck Lofton's crew that was racing around at 70 MPH on the county roads. Wonderful time to be in an accident.

There is a way on CHIRP to lock out the TX function. Turn "Duplex" off. It should lock the TX mode out.