Attended my First Appleseed, need rifle upgrades!

[Pitmaster]

Don't forget at least one person has scored Rifleman with a Cricket.

 

[Bapak2ja]

I have been to several Appleseeds and I love going. I think that they like to tell people that you don't need a special, modified rifle to learn marksmanship. However, there are some things that I would recommend to everyone taking a 10/22 to Appleseed.

1. Extended mag release. I sanded off the sharp corners of my mags and they drop right out. You have to work on them a little bit.
Edit - Hey, I just noticed that the picture of the rifle that you linked to has the extended mag release on it already. You got it.
2. Auto Bolt Release mod. You can buy the modified part or easily modify your stock bolt release. See internet for instructions.
3. The triggers on 10/22 rifles purchased recently are terrible. They have 8 to 9 lb pull. I installed a Power Custom Hammer and Sear kit. It is now a 2-3/4 trigger.
4. Tech Sights are a great addition.

The easiest way to get the best set up is to buy the whole trigger group from Timney or Kidd. You just drop it in the receiver and put the pins in. Done. You may even find that the cost is pretty fair compared to buying bits and pieces that you have to put together.

I use the same rifle for squirrel hunting and it all works well.

If you do these mods you will be scoring much better the next time you go to Appleseed. Have fun.

Overkill. I used my 10/22 right out of the box with a cheap Barska scope similar to this one. Amazon.com: BARSKA 3-9x32 Plinker-22 Riflescope: Sports & Outdoors. Nothing fancy, just a basic scope.

I did have the extended mag release installed. Still had trouble with it releasing, but had lots more trouble with inserting the new one. Did not want to line up properly.

I did not qualify at the minimum level, but it had nothing to do with the mag release. I got all the allowed shots off within the time frame except when I got crossed up and could not remember at which target I was supposed to be shooting. My bad, not the mag or the rifle.

I used the factory trigger. It worked just fine.

My conclusion is that a 10/22 right out of the box is good enough to score marksman at Appleseed. I did upgrade the mag release, and I recommend it; but it is not essential. You do not need to upgrade the trigger to succeed at Appleseed. You just need to follow the instructions, focus, keep your head in the game. My failure to qualify was due to my failure to focus and keep my head in the game. Blaming the equipment on a 10/22 for not qualifying at Appleseed is just a failure to man up and take responsibility.

With a little practice, and maybe another round of coaching at Appleseed, I will qualify with that same rifle. My best score was 187, so I did not reach the goal of 210; but the failures were in my performance, not the equipment.

BTW, I used the scope because these 62-yr-old eyes just can't get hte job done with steel sights now. As I improve my technique, I will try it with the steel sights, though.

 

[yellowhousejake]

I will advise against any auto bolt release, they create more problems than they solve. Think about it, when you begin your course of fire, your rifle is already loaded. You should have been removing your chamber flag and releasing your bolt during your prep time which is off the clock, so no advantage there. While some folks have told me that the auto bolt release is faster I do not see where, the bolt doesn't lock back after the mag is empty, so you are still having to cycle the bolt. Pull it back 1/4" or pull it back 2", is that really important?

The auto bolt release also disables the bolt lock. I've seen a ton of folks on the line who accidently release the bolt when installing the chamber flag, or tie up the action by releasing the bolt while removing the chamber flag. Either way you now have to stop what you are doing to reposition the rifle and use two hands to undo what just happened.

Last weekend I taught four more people how to lock and unlock their bolt with one hand, easily, quickly, and it took just a minute. They are part of a long list. When their bolts are locked back, they really are locked back, not just-kinda-maybe-held to the rear until the rifle or bolt handle is bumped accidentally.

I can't say no to aftermarket parts, if they make you feel better about your rifle, then okay. But I will say that the number of mechanical issues I have seen in the last four years of Appleseed, is directly proportional to the number of aftermarket parts installed on the rifle. Many of the popular parts can make your rifle operate smoother, look nicer, or feel better. But your rifle will not shoot any more accurately, your scores will not be higher. Spend the money on ammo and practice.

YHJ

 

[TJ Kackowski]

Speaking of practice ... this link was posted in another thread that may be of some use. The targets are scaled for 10' ... yes, 10'.

Awesome to use indoors working on NPOA rather than sitting on the couch watching TV.

http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.p...0;attach=12585

 

[TJ Kackowski]

Last weekend I taught four more people how to lock and unlock their bolt with one hand, easily, quickly, and it took just a minute. They are part of a long list. When their bolts are locked back, they really are locked back, not just-kinda-maybe-held to the rear until the rifle or bolt handle is bumped accidentally.
YHJ

Sometime you'll have to show me this trick. I moved to the autobolt release only after much struggling and frustration with Bill Rugers original design ... I swear he's a sadist.

 

[yellowhousejake]

Sometime you'll have to show me this trick. I moved to the autobolt release only after much struggling and frustration with Bill Rugers original design ... I swear he's a sadist.

It's easier to show you but try this.

With your right hand pull the bolt back with your thumb and hold it back. Use your index finger to pull the bolt release lever back as well. While holding the bolt release lever, release the bolt with your thumb. The bolt will lock back.

To unlock, pull the bolt all the way back with your thumb. Use your index finger to push the bolt release forward until it clicks, then release the bolt.

1) To lock or unlock, begin by always holding the bolt fully to the rear.
2) To lock the bolt to the rear, hold the release to the rear.
3) To unlock the bolt allowing it forward, push the release forward.

Step one is the key to success, don't hold the bolt fully to the rear, and it doesn't work.

Once you do it, it's a piece of cake.

YHJ

 

[mlzoiss]

Mlzoiss you were doing a great job on the line and you had the teachable attitude. that is the most important thing. What ol'huff and slough are getting at is that a lot of people show up with there 1k kidd race rifles and think that the rifle alone will do all the work for them. they don't actually listen to what the instructors are saying and showing them. they say well I got this 1000 dollar rifle I don't need to worry about my npoa or blah blah blah and they try to ride the out the rifles ability vs taking the time to learn the fundamentals and apply them.

The tech sights would be a great upgrade and are much needed over the stock sights IMO. that v and brass bead are horrible. You have never had the auto bolt release and you weren't struggling with the factory so there is no need for you to get it. your stock trigger is fine and you were doing well with it.

Your fine and your learning the fundamentals and that is what's important. Practice with what you have. Get the tech sights and just continue to practice dry firing and get to another appleseed when you can

Besides the stock sights, I was struggling with the mag installation and release. That was really my main concern, and the problem I was trying to solve/solicit advice for.

 

[Hop]

It might be the indian but even an indian need a sharpened arrow. If making a rifle run more smoothly & efficiently is "gaming" then maybe Sloughfoot should try his next seed using a muzzle loader.

In my case, fixing the extractor was a must. The VQ extractor has been flawless.

I didn't really "need" these "while I was in there mods" but they made the gun a lot more user friendly IMO:
VQ hammer. Great trigger pull with no other mods.
Dremel modified auto-bolt release.
An extended mag relase (my older 10/22 had a flat one).
Radius & polished the bolt a little.
I also made a bolt stop. Works fine but not really much quieter.

 

[Hop]

YHJ's 10/22 one handed bolt lock / unlock technique works.

 

[yellowhousejake]

Besides the stock sights, I was struggling with the mag installation and release.

The secret to a smooth mag insertion is where you push. Start the mag into the well, then with your index finger, push up hard on the Ruger emblem on the bottom of the mag. The molded emblem is slightly forward of center. Your finger can find it easily and it rocks slightly the mag and allows it to cam the mag button back and let the mag pass into the well easily. Just like the bolt release, easier to show you than to tell you. But once you do it, it's a snap.

If anyone thinks they need gizmo's to remove a 10-22 mag in order to do well, watch someone shoot a Rifleman score with a 795. The most horrible Ruger mag is almost dangling in the stock compared to a Marlin mag.

I will throw in with the exact edge extractor. While the extractor is not needed on a blow back action to remove the case, a sharp extractor ensures the empty case has a good pivot point when it hits the ejector. It's not needed so to speak, but it will allow your 10-22 to run longer dirtier without stovepiping.

YHJ

 

[grunt soldier]

Besides the stock sights, I was struggling with the mag installation and release. That was really my main concern, and the problem I was trying to solve/solicit advice for.

I didn't get to see does your rifle have the extended mag release or is it the flat one that doesn't protrude down at all? the picture you linked has the extended mag release. My advice is if it doesn't have the extended mag release then get one. they are nice, cheap and make it easier to get the mag out. if it already has the extended on then just get down in the prone and practice dropping a mag and putting the next one in. you can even sit in the seated position on the couch and practice if you prefer.


AND to address the rest of this thread. You guys are going to hear all kinds of different view points. from purists to the modders, the most important thing to remember is show up with a teachable attitude and pay attention to what the instructors are showing you! If you have a 2000 dollar race rifle or a 60 year old tuber it doesn't matter. if you learn the fundamentals and absorb what is being taught you will be a much better shooter. Basically what everyone of the you don't need to mod your rifle group are saying is that you don't need to do a bunch of stuff to shoot better. you just need to do what is being taught to you by the instructors and you will do fine!


The moral of this whole thread is attend the next appleseed you can, bring the equipment you have (don't put off attending a appleseed so you can "upgrade your rifle" and bring some friends with you!

 

[RobbyMaQ]

Tech sights were a great investment, especially for appleseed. it makes understanding moa, and adjusting poi much easier than fiddling with a rear blade sight. it can still be done with a blade adjustment, but with so much to learn at appleseed, the simple clicks on the tech sights make comprehension so much easier (by taking all the guesswork out of adjustment).

I went with a new extractor because my old '73 model ruger was having extraction issues. Since replacement, I've not had another FTE.

One of the cheapest mod's you can do, is bandage wrap and pipe insulation on the stock

 

[ol' Huff]

The front sight assemvly on my tech sights just bit 5he dust. Of course I had to drop it onto concrete from about 6 feet. The cerakote survived the fall.

 

[gregkl]

I agree with everyone here!

My thoughts are that you are going to an Appleseed partly to learn how to shoot properly according to their awesome teaching methods.

For me, if I can come to the line and I have made some changes to my rifle to make it easier to drop mags, insert mags, Squeeeeze the trigger and follow through all while having the eyesight to see the front sight, then why not.

I would rather focus on the fundamental instructions then get distracted by "tool" issues.

I fought malfunctions almost every string on my weekend and frankly it distracted me from getting the full benefit of the 2 days. Last night, I invested over 2 hours completely stripping my rifle down and cleaned 40 years of crusty gunk that required magnifiers to see. My rifle is probably one of the best, if not the best .22 rifles ever made and it didn't run near as good as my wife's $200 .22. I didn't have the optics set right and fought that also.

Sure, bring what you have since once you go to one, you will probably want to go back, but do your best to "prepare" beforehand.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Tech sights are a huuuuge improvement over the stock sights.


I have a hogue stock that I had to sand the mag well a little bit to get the mags to drop free. Holding the mag well vertically is very important to dropping mags from a tight magwell 10/22.

Everybody wants their rifle to be like they want it to be, so you configure your rifle like you want it, but if it were my rifle, I would want to make sure I had a GI loop sling and some kind of sight upgrade (tech sights or a low mag optic with a simple crosshair).

 

[ol' Huff]

TBE is really smart sometimes.

 

[Mudcat]

The extractors are about the only thing I recommend on LTRs other than Tech Sights or low power optic. The new 10/22s have a decent mag release from the factory. If I have an optic on it I put a buffer in it I've found that it helps them live a little longer without the constant banging of the bolt into the steel pin. The extractor and buffer are reliability mods and can be had for less than $15. A loop sling is an obvious addition. But then again I have become partial to the Marlin 795 over the last year ( another thing I contribute to YHJ) and they only need sights, extra magazine and a sling. A little mod that allows dry fire without a magazine inserted is nice though.
To a Rifleman the rifle does not matter the Rifleman is what matters. I have shot Rifleman with a multitude of different rifles because I am a Rifleman.

 

[RobbyMaQ]

The extractors are about the only thing I recommend on LTRs other than Tech Sights or low power optic. The new 10/22s have a decent mag release from the factory. If I have an optic on it I put a buffer in it I've found that it helps them live a little longer without the constant banging of the bolt into the steel pin. The extractor and buffer are reliability mods and can be had for less than $15. A loop sling is an obvious addition. But then again I have become partial to the Marlin 795 over the last year ( another thing I contribute to YHJ) and they only need sights, extra magazine and a sling. A little mod that allows dry fire without a magazine inserted is nice though.
To a Rifleman the rifle does not matter the Rifleman is what matters. I have shot Rifleman with a multitude of different rifles because I am a Rifleman.

My son had an "AHA" moment Monday night while league shooting. He's only 11 and just started this summer, and going through the lessons/positions. Much of the basics were learned at his first appleseed earlier in the spring.

Until monday, he'd always shot a winchester bolt gun with blade sights & 5 round mag. (I had as a kid). Monday, he shot using a loaner competition rifle from the league. When we were done, he was off target, but had a hole about the size of a gold ball for his groups. He understood that groups mater, and wasn't bothered by being off target, since we didn't want to mess with adjusting the loaner sights.

He was surprised stating "I can't believe I shot such a good group with that rifle considering I never shot it before and the sights are way different than anything I have shot before". To which I reminded him, that if the fundamentals are there, it doesn't matter what rifle you shoot with.

 

[hooky]

For the money you spend tricking out a 10/22, you could buy a new marlin 795, an extra mag and tec sights or a inexpensive optic.

 

[ol' Huff]

The 795 is HUGE bang for the buck.