Are You Going to Jail? (The next installment)

[thebishopp]

Probably so. First the shed is not attached to the house, hence no burglary. Probably just theft. You might be able to convince the prosecutor that the person running out of the shed was threatening you if he was running towards you and it was a natural reaction but doutful. I don't think that you could convince a jury that your life was in danger. It would be okay to hold them at gunpoint until the police arrived (not knowing what they have on them and if you feel threatened) but if they decide to make a break...sorry.

Please daddy, tell us how close we are (comic relief).

Hey, if I recall you are from evansville... do you remember the ex-police officer who shot the robber as he fled the pizza joint he just robbed? If I remember the incident right the prosecutor (Stan Levco, I believe) issued no charges. I think he even shot the guy in the back. It's been awhile so I can't remember all the details but I thought you might.

 

[lrahm]

Hey, if I recall you are from evansville... do you remember the ex-police officer who shot the robber as he fled the pizza joint he just robbed? If I remember the incident right the prosecutor (Stan Levco, I believe) issued no charges. I think he even shot the guy in the back. It's been awhile so I can't remember all the details but I thought you might.

The only thing I can remember was the guy who robbed one of the larger stores on Green River Road. The guy threatened one of the employees with a knife. The officer chased him down and shot him in the back as he was going over a fence. This had been some time ago. I know both names. The suspect became wheel chair bound and still caused a lot of problems. Night that be what you are talking about?

 

[GuyRelford]

OP, pleaase clarify, did they rush towards you? Did they see you?

You just see them rushing out the door in your general direction. You don't know if they've seen you or not.

 

[indytechnerd]

What about firing a "warning" shot into the ground to scare them away?

That only works in Carmel against dogs.

To stay on topic....
I think this is beatable, you might spend the night in the hooskow, but I think you'll be ok. This, of course, is if you follow the #1 rule, which is to shut your pie hole until you've talked to a lawyer.

Facts:
1. 20' distance and closing
2. it's dark out, and the BGs are backlit from the shed
3. 2 BG vs. 1 GG (in my underwear)

"Officer, these 2 guys come bustin' outta my shed right for me, but I'd like to consult my attorney before saying anything else."

It's your (fenced off) property, your position as well as the BGs can be ascertained, and the live BG may or may not make it to refute any claim you make.

To TFT:
Does the BG survive until the po-po can question him?

You shoot twice, killing the first one and wounding the other.

You hold the wounded man at gun-point while your wife calls the police.

 

[RoyalTenenbaum]

Was the homeowner in fear for his life or wellbeing when the two rushed in his direction inside of the 21 foot perimeter?

 

[thebishopp]

The only thing I can remember was the guy who robbed one of the larger stores on Green River Road. The guy threatened one of the employees with a knife. The officer chased him down and shot him in the back as he was going over a fence. This had been some time ago. I know both names. The suspect became wheel chair bound and still caused a lot of problems. Night that be what you are talking about?

I think it was late 99 or early 2000ish (maybe even later but I believe definitely before 05. If it was that long ago that was probably it. I remember the newspaper report that Levco officially declined to press charges on the officer (who I think was a former officer and not an active one).

 

[lrahm]

I think it was late 99 or early 2000ish (maybe even later but I believe definitely before 05. If it was that long ago that was probably it. I remember the newspaper report that Levco officially declined to press charges on the officer (who I think was a former officer and not an active one).

I can't seem to remember that one. Give me a little time and I will look into that.

 

[GuyRelford]

To TFT:
Does the BG survive until the po-po can question him?

Yes, he does.

 

[indytechnerd]

To TFT:
Does the BG survive until the po-po can question him?

Yes, he does.

Damn. Ok, I'm still betting on no long term stay as a guest of IDOC. If the LEO/DA believes a wounded burglar in my fenced yard, at night, after exiting my locked outbuilding, then I lose I guess.

 

[thebishopp]

I can't seem to remember that one. Give me a little time and I will look into that.

If it is the pizza place one then it has to be that... surely there were not two incidents where someone robbed a pizza place in evansville and was shot in the back lol. Maybe it was 04 or 05 though I could have sworn it was earlier... oh well, I thought it was a good call (declining charges against the shooter - the guy who was not the robber) by Levco as I think it was a good message to send to would be robbers/criminals (rob someone and you just may get shot lol).

 

[thebishopp]

You're right. And the same reasoning applies to going out to your shed with a gun. Having a gun doesnt mean you're not going to lose the fight. Theres no guarantee that you and your however many millions of practice rounds down range will win an encounter.

If a gun is your preferred weapon, take it out there. If an axe or a machete is your preferred weapon, take it out there. If your hands are your preferred weapon, take only those.

I can definitely agree with that.

 

[spec4]

You just see them rushing out the door in your general direction. You don't know if they've seen you or not.

Thanks, if they were heading in my direction I would give them one chance to stop, then I would be in fear of my life if you get the drift.

 

[GuyRelford]

So, does that answer the question in the OP?

Thanks, if they were heading in my direction I would give them one chance to stop, then I would be in fear of my life if you get the drift.

 

[moischmoe]

Was there any bacon in the shed? If so, I say it's a good shoot, because I was trying to save my bacon.

 

[IndyGunSafety]

They were not entering... they were exiting. They were not attacking, they were fleeing. Also, the force has to be reasonable.

 

[lrahm]

If it is the pizza place one then it has to be that... surely there were not two incidents where someone robbed a pizza place in evansville and was shot in the back lol. Maybe it was 04 or 05 though I could have sworn it was earlier... oh well, I thought it was a good call (declining charges against the shooter - the guy who was not the robber) by Levco as I think it was a good message to send to would be robbers/criminals (rob someone and you just may get shot lol).

I hate to say it but I really can't remember. I will look into it. We don't have many officer shootings and one that is retired would stick out. On the side we do have a liquor store that has been robbed several times and the owner has shot several people. He is one person you don't mess with. You would also think that people would learn by now.

We also had a jeweler (all on tape, I watched 3 times, very funny) who had a guy who wanted to see some expensive rings. You could see the body language of the guy inching towards the door. As he mad a break for the door, the owner hit a switch which locked it. He then proceeded to pull a .410 pistol on him until the police arrived. The suspect cried like a baby.

 

[thebishopp]

I hate to say it but I really can't remember. I will look into it. We don't have many officer shootings and one that is retired would stick out. On the side we do have a liquor store that has been robbed several times and the owner has shot several people. He is one person you don't mess with. You would also think that people would learn by now.

We also had a jeweler (all on tape, I watched 3 times, very funny) who had a guy who wanted to see some expensive rings. You could see the body language of the guy inching towards the door. As he mad a break for the door, the owner hit a switch which locked it. He then proceeded to pull a .410 pistol on him until the police arrived. The suspect cried like a baby.

The former officer in the pizza robber shooting worked there part time I think. He might not have been retired, maybe just left the department.

Yes you would think they would learn lol, sadly they do not seem to be overly bright... at least not at the "average criminal" level anyway, which is probably a good thing. It would probably be bad if more of them were "hannibal lector" smart.

 

[BDBHoover]

TFT....... If the property was indeed fenced in..... Was there any signage indicating No Trespassing? You were at around 21' from said storage shed before they busted through the door in your direction..... Did the homeowner have the weapon in the "ready to fire" position or did he have it lowered and then when they busted through the door, he raised and fired out of reflex? What kind of fencing was used.... was it standard 4' chain link or 6' wooden privacy? How is the back area layed out? Say your looking at your garage from the driveway..... Is the shed behind the garage and is there a fence seperating the garage and shed on the property? I have a feeling that some if not all of these instances would play a factor in the outcome......

 

[GuyRelford]

TFT....... If the property was indeed fenced in..... Was there any signage indicating No Trespassing? You were at around 21' from said storage shed before they busted through the door in your direction..... Did the homeowner have the weapon in the "ready to fire" position or did he have it lowered and then when they busted through the door, he raised and fired out of reflex? What kind of fencing was used.... was it standard 4' chain link or 6' wooden privacy? How is the back area layed out? Say your looking at your garage from the driveway..... Is the shed behind the garage and is there a fence seperating the garage and shed on the property? I have a feeling that some if not all of these instances would play a factor in the outcome......

It's a perimeter fence only, 6' privacy.

 

[moischmoe]

I suspect that because the fence is a perimeter fence, it doesn't qualify as curtilage.

Now if the fence was connected to the house and enclosed a smaller space, such as around a deck, (think of the fenced in deck as just another room of your house), then that would definitely be considered curtilage.