Appendix Carry: Pros and Cons?

[cedartop]

I am an AIWWB convert. For many years I played the you'll shoot your junk off card, and avoided it, then I tried it, then I drilled with it, then I pressure tested it in FoF evo's with guys trying to knock my head off. You know what, the experts I had been talking with were right, it is faster, easier to access in a contact distance fight, and easier to defend in case the bad guy finds the gun before you've made a window to present.

I converted about 3 years ago, and never looked back. I still have many, and run the occasional belt rig when teaching, but when it comes time to put on a rig to go out in public, it's nearly always and AIWB.

I've tried several rigs, I will saw that AIWB is one of the more holster dependent carry methods out there. It is also body type dependent. If you are very short torso'd, and have a bit of a paunch, it can be very difficult to find something that works well, and feels comfortable. For me, I'm tall, and don't carry much extra weight, so I've got a bit more leeway.

Others have stated some very nice gear, Raven ACR, Archangel, Desbiens. I would add the Raven VanGuard 2 to the list, although you're going to need a training holster because it's just not a great option for repeated drilling. I had a chance to play around a bit with the Keeper's Concealment holster called The Keeper. This seems like it will be a front runner in the AIWB market, and several guys who's opinion's I trust greatly say it's great kit. Having said that, mine is not here yet but will be shortly for some T&E. I'll be sure to update you once I have a chance to run it through some paces.

Just something to keep in mind, extremely short barreled pistols don't tend to sit well in AIWB, I've noticed this with standard IWB as well, just not as pronounced. The short barrels tend not to have enough mass below the belt line to remain stable, and if you combine that with a bit of a spare tire, they tend to want to push out at the top away from the body and print a bit. The keeper is the first AIWB that I've seen to take this into account and correct for it. That's one reason I'm excited to try it out.

Just my thoughts from a few years at it, YMMV.

Tinman....

Well, I guess I don't have to respond now. Tinman and iChokePeople did all of the work for me. Good posts guys.

Seriously, the only argument I have with any of what is being said, is that I don't think with a good holster it is that body type dependent. I have seen people of all shapes and sizes making good use of it, and finding after they gave it a fair try that it is about as comfortable as sticking something big and hard inside your pants can be. With something like a Fricke Archangel for it it is extremely comfortable.ARCHANGEL APPENDIX CARRY AIWB (Appendix Inside the Waist Band)
I actually currently use the Seraphim which is just the Archangel made to fit an RMR equipped pistol. As far as the Zach/Vangaurd type holsters go, they are great ideas and both quality products, but I find a real holster to be more comfortable.

Safety, well if you can't learn to keep your finger off the trigger, maybe carrying isn't for you period. Covering yourself during the draw? Yes, but you do this with any type of IWB. Todd Louis Green, another AIWB devotee, actually has students show him before class that they can safely reholster with appendix carry. Part of his tip is to sorta twist the holster out away from yourself as you are holstering for added safety. (It is easier than it sounds).

Of our 30+ instructors, probably only a handful don't carry AIWB (well techically I don't either because I am left handed and your appendix is on you right) and that is primarily because they carry 3 oclockish on duty and want to keep that consistency.

Oh, and by the way, even though it is probably at the height of its popularity right now, this is far from a fad as it has been used for many a year past by knowledgable gunman.

 

[AD Marc]

Charles Darwin chuckles at your attempts to rob fate.

Maybe you didn't catch the snark in my post?

 

[Kagnew]

I've always liked either pancreas or gall bladder carry.

 

[cosermann]

I'm a big proponent of spleen carry myself.

Seriously though, let me ask you folks who have more experience w/apdx. carry a body type question. I've tried this carry method a few times and could just never find it comfortable. I don't carry much extra weight, so I don't think that's the issue. However, the vertical distance between the waist and where my legs bend doesn't seem to be long enough to allow a gun of any significant size to ride there (and I think I'm fairly normally proportioned). I think a tailor would call this measurement the "rise" (the distance from the waist to the crotch).

What am I missing?

Edit: After looking at these pics - http://fateoflegions.blogspot.com/2012/04/appendix-carry-illustrated.html

I'm thinking I might just need to try it closer to centerline.

 

[youngda9]

Maybe you didn't catch the snark in my post?

Implying that you really know just how under control of your fine motor skills you'll be with a knife weilding madman barreling down on you. We caught it, and ignored it.

 

[AD Marc]

Implying that you really know just how under control of your fine motor skills you'll be with a knife weilding madman barreling down on you. We caught it, and ignored it.

I guess that it might be hard to understand if you're currently at the level where you have to consciously think about keeping your finger off of the trigger.

 

[rhino]

I use Comp-Tac CTAC for appendix IWB carry. You can adjust it to ride vertically and low enough so that the gun doesn't fall out.

I've tried three different brands of holsters designed specifically for appendix carry, but each one of them flipped out of my belt when I leaned forward. Most of them ride too high for me, and they only had one belt attachment. The CTAC has two.

 

[PriestEG]

but more seriously than the pic says. im not sure i like the idea of have my EDC pointed at my femoral artery. not a comfortable way to carry either

 

[youngda9]

I guess that it might be hard to understand if you're currently at the level where you have to consciously think about keeping your finger off of the trigger.

I told you I got it the first time...you're macho.

 

[dom1104]

Well, I guess I don't have to respond now. Tinman and iChokePeople did all of the work for me. Good posts guys.

Seriously, the only argument I have with any of what is being said, is that I don't think with a good holster it is that body type dependent. I have seen people of all shapes and sizes making good use of it, and finding after they gave it a fair try that it is about as comfortable as sticking something big and hard inside your pants can be. With something like a Fricke Archangel for it it is extremely comfortable.ARCHANGEL APPENDIX CARRY AIWB (Appendix Inside the Waist Band)
I actually currently use the Seraphim which is just the Archangel made to fit an RMR equipped pistol. As far as the Zach/Vangaurd type holsters go, they are great ideas and both quality products, but I find a real holster to be more comfortable.

Safety, well if you can't learn to keep your finger off the trigger, maybe carrying isn't for you period. Covering yourself during the draw? Yes, but you do this with any type of IWB. Todd Louis Green, another AIWB devotee, actually has students show him before class that they can safely reholster with appendix carry. Part of his tip is to sorta twist the holster out away from yourself as you are holstering for added safety. (It is easier than it sounds).

Of our 30+ instructors, probably only a handful don't carry AIWB (well techically I don't either because I am left handed and your appendix is on you right) and that is primarily because they carry 3 oclockish on duty and want to keep that consistency.

Oh, and by the way, even though it is probably at the height of its popularity right now, this is far from a fad as it has been used for many a year past by knowledgable gunman.

Ok, but I REALLY need to AIWB this. Its the new hot thing.

Does Fricke make a holster yet?

 

[indiucky]

Charles Darwin chuckles at your attempts to rob fate.

And I chuckle at Charles Darwin's attempts to explain "The origins of Man".

I do carry appendix. Hammerless 640-1 in an IWB. I feel like I have more control of my weapon when it is holstered and towards my right front. I tried every carry method and this is what I settled on. I went hammerless because a couple of years after we got married my wife looked at my gut and said, "What's that funny red mark there on your belly." That was the moment I knew that age had caught up to me (and my gut) and hammerless became the CCW of choice of a man whose belly had finally caught up to his hammer.

 

[esrice]

I want to like appendix carry for all the reported benefits, but I haven't ever found a setup that works well. I have a longer torso and shorter legs, so this may have something to do with it. Or maybe I just haven't found the right position or gear.

As I lose weight I keep trying it with a blue gun to see if it works "yet".

 

[lovemachine]

For the guys that carry AIWB, are your pants pulled up higher?

What's your procedure when in the restroom?
Do you typically wear an undershirt?
Which material holster works the best? Kydex or leather?

 

[dom1104]

For the guys that carry AIWB, are your pants pulled up higher?

What's your procedure when in the restroom?
Do you typically wear an undershirt?
Which material holster works the best? Kydex or leather?

1. Yes. URKLE high.
2. We dont use the restroom. ever.
3. never. the rug protests.
4. Leather. This is a stupid question, do YOU want hard plastic cuttin into your junk?

 

[Excalibur]

I've got some meat sticking out of my gut, so I can't carry like this

 

[lovemachine]

1. Yes. URKLE high.
2. We dont use the restroom. ever.
3. never. the rug protests.
4. Leather. This is a stupid question, do YOU want hard plastic cuttin into your junk?

Stupid question?

It was already said that the Raven Concealment appendix holster was one of the best, and "gasp!", it's Kydex!

 

[Tinman]

Real answers:

1) No, no higher than anybody else. If you wear your pants so loose they're flopping down showing plumber's crack, you're going to have issues with this carry method.

2) I unzip, reach through and slide the muzzle a little bit over, and commence as normal. It really isn't as big a deal as you think.

3) Yes I do, but that's just a comfort thing to me. If you don't normally wear one, you shouldn't need to for AIWB.

4) Doesn't matter, your choice. Find a holster you like and run it. I have found the kydex versions tend to be more adjustable so they are a little easier for me to fit.

To answer some other questions, position and cant is personal preference. Most people seem to prefer a more centerline position, and a slight reverse cant. As I recall, many many years ago, some of the first testing with apex carry was done using cross draw holsters.

I've also found that trying to press a standard IWB even one that's straight vertical into AIWB is less than optimal.

As far as safety of AIWB, I haven't shot myself drawing from an OWB holster, and IWB holster, an AIWB holster, or the security holster mounted to my armor, even under duress. I'm comfortable with my abilities, and safety using AIWB, not everyone will be, so be it. If you don't like it, don't carry that way, nobody is forcing you to. Having said all that, yes I use a little more caution when reholstering regardless of where I carry.

Tinman....

 

[iChokePeople]

Real answers:

1) No, no higher than anybody else. If you wear your pants so loose they're flopping down showing plumber's crack, you're going to have issues with this carry method.

2) I unzip, reach through and slide the muzzle a little bit over, and commence as normal. It really isn't as big a deal as you think.

3) Yes I do, but that's just a comfort thing to me. If you don't normally wear one, you shouldn't need to for AIWB.

4) Doesn't matter, your choice. Find a holster you like and run it. I have found the kydex versions tend to be more adjustable so they are a little easier for me to fit.

To answer some other questions, position and cant is personal preference. Most people seem to prefer a more centerline position, and a slight reverse cant. As I recall, many many years ago, some of the first testing with apex carry was done using cross draw holsters.

I've also found that trying to press a standard IWB even one that's straight vertical into AIWB is less than optimal.

As far as safety of AIWB, I haven't shot myself drawing from an OWB holster, and IWB holster, an AIWB holster, or the security holster mounted to my armor, even under duress. I'm comfortable with my abilities, and safety using AIWB, not everyone will be, so be it. If you don't like it, don't carry that way, nobody is forcing you to. Having said all that, yes I use a little more caution when reholstering regardless of where I carry.

Tinman....

^^^. Agree on all points.

 

[cedartop]

For the guys that carry AIWB, are your pants pulled up higher?

What's your procedure when in the restroom?
Do you typically wear an undershirt?
Which material holster works the best? Kydex or leather?

Higher then what? They are just "normal" height I think.

Restroom procedure... Okay, actually IMHO this is another area AIWB shines. It is tough to explain here, but the hoster and gun jst sit on top of my leg. Standing up, it is a non issue, nothing different than normal.

Yes, I wear an undershirt, though many don't.

I like Kydex, but that is not Appendix related, Except for my Ranch Hand, I have no more use for leather holsters.

 

[cedartop]

Ok, but I REALLY need to AIWB this. Its the new hot thing.

Does Fricke make a holster yet?

I don't think Dale does slings, Maybe Blade tech. I'll let you know when mine comes in.