Adam Kokesh Vs Activism

[Lupin3rd]

Many of my libertarian friends are talking about the upcoming Adam Kokesh DC open carry protest. I wrote a piece for WeAreLibertarians.com demonstrating why this is a bad idea from an activism perspective.

Peffers: Adam Vs Activism - We Are LibertariansWe Are Libertarians

 

[rambone]

It isn’t an effort to lobby or to portray firearm owners as law-abiding people, as all of them have violated federal law.

Is there no place for civil disobedience? The point, in my opinion, is to illustrate that laws that would call for the arrest of several thousand peaceful protesters are seriously flawed. Just like laws that call for the arrest of people who refuse to sit at the back of the bus.

And just like the civil rights protests of decades past, the protests require civility in order to capture public sympathy. When police crush the protesters with excessive violence it will just demonstrate to the public what a police state these laws have created.

 

[Lupin3rd]

I definitely agree that the laws are unjust. I wanted to point out the likely perception of the protesters by the general public.

 

[rambone]

Is there a method of activism that you feel is more effective and preferable?

 

[bhowell34]

Yeah I think it's a tough situation we are in now. The violence of the government and police state is pretty scary. But is pointing this out to the mass public worth getting a felony? Not sure which course of action will lead to the change we want. But at least he is getting attention from the media on the subject

 

[jamil]

Is there no place for civil disobedience? The point, in my opinion, is to illustrate that laws that would call for the arrest of several thousand peaceful protesters are seriously flawed. Just like laws that call for the arrest of people who refuse to sit at the back of the bus.

And just like the civil rights protests of decades past, the protests require civility in order to capture public sympathy. When police crush the protesters with excessive violence it will just demonstrate to the public what a police state these laws have created.

In the civil rights protests up through the 70s, pop culture had a conscience that sympathized with a class of people who just wanted to be treated equally. The success of those protests was possible only because the press presented news of the protests in a way favorable to the protesters.

The press doesn't like gun owners. Pop culture has no conscience or sympathy for what it believes is a bunch of white redneck men who just want to be able to carry their toys anywhere they want. The ACLU will not bail you out. The NRA won't either. The press will vilify you, and because of that, so will pop culture. And if things go badly (what could possibly go wrong with a thousand+ armed libertarian extremists marching on DC?) the press will be all over it. Then, at a time when news of Obama scandals are still likely to occupy the news cycle, gun grabbing reporters and politicians will be able to renew the push for gun control.

You are naive if you think that this type of protest will achieve for gun rights the same success as the civil rights movement.

 

[Bummer]

Is there a method of activism that you feel is more effective and preferable?

Well, yes, actually. I think that they should each be carrying a 30 round magazine (gutted?). A few could have signs showing David Gregory waving a 30 round mag during his Wayne LaPierre interview in a DC studio.

The DC Prosecutor has already stated that harassment and prosecution of Gregory for simply holding such a magazine would serve no useful purpose, how could he now contend that harassment and prosecution of others simply holding such magazines could serve a useful public purpose?

Actual guns he, and his minions, could easily wet themselves over, but something he's already declared to be inconsequential? The Prosecutor has set that precedent, has he not?

 

[rambone]

Suggestions, alternatives? Hang the guns back up in the closet and keep waiting?

 

[indyjack]

Hang the guns back up in the closet and keep waiting?

that seems to be the general consensus... because slavery has become comforting to most. it's a hard truth to deal with, but truth non the less.

 

[CarmelHP]

Well, yes, actually. I think that they should each be carrying a 30 round magazine (gutted?). A few could have signs showing David Gregory waving a 30 round mag during his Wayne LaPierre interview in a DC studio.

The DC Prosecutor has already stated that harassment and prosecution of Gregory for simply holding such a magazine would serve no useful purpose, how could he now contend that harassment and prosecution of others simply holding such magazines could serve a useful public purpose?

Actual guns he, and his minions, could easily wet themselves over, but something he's already declared to be inconsequential? The Prosecutor has set that precedent, has he not?

No, he means a purpose useful to HIM, which is banning guns, Gregory was all in for gun banning, bagging a bunch of protestors who are anti-ban would be useful to his goal.

 

[jamil]

No, he means a purpose useful to HIM, which is banning guns, Gregory was all in for gun banning, bagging a bunch of protestors who are anti-ban would be useful to his goal.

True, but he'd need a lot of help from the media to explain why arresting thousands of protesters who are just holding gutted magazines serves a more useful purpose than arresting a talking head for holding a fully functional illegal magazine.

 

[gunowner930]

Suggestions, alternatives? Hang the guns back up in the closet and keep waiting?

Well, yes, actually. I think that they should each be carrying a 30 round magazine (gutted?). A few could have signs showing David Gregory waving a 30 round mag during his Wayne LaPierre interview in a DC studio.

The DC Prosecutor has already stated that harassment and prosecution of Gregory for simply holding such a magazine would serve no useful purpose, how could he now contend that harassment and prosecution of others simply holding such magazines could serve a useful public purpose?

Actual guns he, and his minions, could easily wet themselves over, but something he's already declared to be inconsequential? The Prosecutor has set that precedent, has he not?

Bummer answered this pretty well in my opinion. Furthermore, If 1000+ protesters armed with rifles march across the Potomac into gangster-occupied D.C. All it takes is for one clown on either side to fire one shot and this act of civil disobedience could turn into a bloodbath, and I don't even like to think about what the consequences of such an event would be. However, if they protest with their rifles and empty magazines as Bummer said and the DC Police are made aware of this, then the likelihood of this turning into a gunfight is reduced dramatically.

 

[rambone]

Walking around with illegal magazines is a fine protest idea. I think the Independence Day protesters are looking beyond one recent magazine ordinance though.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Is there no place for civil disobedience? The point, in my opinion, is to illustrate that laws that would call for the arrest of several thousand peaceful protesters are seriously flawed. Just like laws that call for the arrest of people who refuse to sit at the back of the bus.

And just like the civil rights protests of decades past, the protests require civility in order to capture public sympathy. When police crush the protesters with excessive violence it will just demonstrate to the public what a police state these laws have created.

There is a place for civil disobedience in a bid for justice. That said, it has been my experience that far too often when one engages in this sort of activity, one's associates tend to be people far too interested in the disobedience and not all that worried about the civility or the justice.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Can someone give me the cliff notes version of the protestors' plan if they are confronted and ordered to disarm/arrested?

 

[johnny45]

It is stunning how far off of its foundation our republic has fallen.

 

[AD Marc]

It's unlikely that Kokesh will be participating in his protest considering he is currently sitting in federal prison here in Philadelphia charged with a felony.

 

[turnandshoot4]

How much good can you do in federal prison?

None.

Scalia (the majority writer) made the case for restrictions in the Heller decision. I don't know what they are trying to accomplish here or are they just trying to make a scene like at the Jefferson Memorial?

 

[AD Marc]

Well, he was kinda arrested for pre-crime. The charges are ludicrous but will probably keep him from participating in his protest in DC on the 4th. This is what happens when you make yourself a high profile target for the feds, they fabricate some charges and tie you up in a legal battle for as long as it takes.

 

[AD Marc]

I don't really like posting political stuff, and the opinions below are my own and do not necessarily represent Armed Dynamics, but here's the low down:

Basically what happened is Kokesh was a speaker at a marijuana smokeout protest on independence mall. He was not using or in posession of illegal drugs and this same protest has occurred on 4 other occasions and has been left alone by the police. This time they stormed the stage and arrested Kokesh, then charged him with resisting arrest and felony assault on a police officer. There were no other charges. Multiple videos of the event showed Adam cooperating with the arrest. Basically the only purpose for these fabricated charges is to keep Adam from his protest and possibly strip him of his gun rights.

I personally don't think Adam's march on DC is smart or advisable for various reasons, but we as gun owners need to stick together. As liberty lovers we should find this arrest abhorrent regardless of what we think about the guy. This is basically an arrest for pre-crime.

You can donate to Adam's legal defense at this link Adam Kokesh Legal Fund | Free Adam Kokesh (FreeAdam.net)

I can vouch for the authenticity of the above link and that 100% of all donations will go to his legal defense as I personally know the man coordinating this effort and he is contracted by Adam to do this.