Somethings will just leave you end up saying WTF.

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Seriously.... Why adopt Nazism? Idiots should self describe themselves as Mongolian Nationalist. As I understand outside the Western world, Nazism is not looked upon so bad, but still.


This sounds like a bs story, although it maybe real, it's incredibly ridiculous. If real, these mongolians need to grow a spine and lead, not follow (nazis).

Mongolian neo-Nazis: Anti-Chinese sentiment fuels rise of ultra-nationalism

Alarm sounds over rise of extreme groups such as Tsagaan Khass who respect Hitler and reject foreign influence

Their right hands rise to black-clad chests and flash out in salute to their nation: "Sieg heil!" They praise Hitler's devotion to ethnic purity.




But with their high cheekbones, dark eyes and brown skin, they are hardly the Third Reich's Aryan ideal. A new strain of Nazism has found an unlikely home: Mongolia.
Once again, ultra-nationalists have emerged from an impoverished economy and turned upon outsiders. This time the main targets come from China, the rising power to the south.



Groups such as Tsagaan Khass, or White Swastika, portray themselves as patriots standing up for ordinary citizens in the face of foreign crime, rampant inequality, political indifference and corruption.


But critics say they scapegoat and attack the innocent. The US state department has warned travellers of increased assaults on inter-racial couples in recent years – including organised violence by ultra-nationalist groups.
Dayar Mongol threatened to shave the heads of women who sleep with Chinese men. Three years ago, the leader of Blue Mongol was convicted of murdering his daughter's boyfriend, reportedly because the young man had studied in China.
Though Tsagaan Khass leaders say they do not support violence, they are self-proclaimed Nazis. "Adolf Hitler was someone we respect. He taught us how to preserve national identity," said the 41-year-old co-founder, who calls himself Big Brother.
"We don't agree with his extremism and starting the second world war. We are against all those killings, but we support his ideology. We support nationalism rather than fascism."
It is, by any standards, an extraordinary choice. Under Hitler, Soviet prisoners of war who appeared Mongolian were singled out for execution. More recently, far-right groups in Europe have attacked Mongolian migrants.
Not all ultra-nationalists use this iconography; and widespread ignorance about the Holocaust and other atrocities may help to explain why some do.
Tsagaan Khass points out that the swastika is an ancient Asian symbol <---- THAT IS A LIE - NHV) – which is true, but does not explain the group's use of Nazi colours, the Nazi eagle and the Nazi salute; or the large picture of the Führer on Big Brother's cigarette case.
Nor does it seem greatly relevant, given their unabashed admiration for Hitler's racial beliefs.
"We have to make sure that as a nation our blood is pure. That's about our independence," said 23-year-old Battur, pointing out that the population is under three million.
"If we start mixing with Chinese, they will slowly swallow us up. Mongolian society is not very rich. Foreigners come with a lot of money and might start taking our women."
Big Brother acknowledges he discovered such ideas through the nationalist groups that emerged in Russia after the Soviet Union's fall; Mongolia had been a satellite state. But the anti-Chinese tinge is distinct and increasingly popular.
"While most people feel far-right discourse is too extreme, there seems to be a consensus that China is imperialistic, 'evil' and intent on taking Mongolia," said Franck Billé of Cambridge University, who is researching representations of Chinese people in Mongolia.
Hip hop tracks such as Don't Go Too Far, You Chinks by 4 Züg – chorus: "shoot them all, all, all" – have been widely played in bars and clubs. Urban myths abound; some believe Beijing has a secret policy of encouraging men to have sex with Mongolian women.
Yet Tsagaan Khass claims it welcomes law-abiding visitors of all races, and Big Brother can certainly be hospitable.
Enthusiastically shaking hands, he says: "Even though you are a British citizen, you are still Asian, and that makes you very cool."
He says the younger members have taught him to be less extreme and the group appears to be reshaping itself – expelling "criminal elements" and insisting on a good education as a prerequisite for membership. One of the leaders is an interior designer.
But critics fear ultra-nationalists are simply becoming more sophisticated and, quietly, more powerful. Tsagaan Khass say it "works closely" with other organisations and is now discussing a merger.
"Some people are in complete denial … [but] we can no longer deny this is a problem," said Anaraa Nyamdorj, of Mongolia's Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Centre.
The US state department has noted increased reports of xenophobic attacks since the spring. The UN country review cites a recent vicious assault on three young transgender women. When one of the victims publicly blamed an ultra-nationalist group – not Tsagaan Khass – death threats quickly followed.
"They are getting more support from the public," added Enkhjargal Davaasuren, director of the National Centre Against Violence, who fears that ultra-nationalists are growing more confident and victims too scared to come forward. She pointed to a YouTube video posted last year, showing a man roughly shaving a woman's long hair. The victim's face is buried in her hands, but her hunched body reeks of fear.
Others in Ulan Bator suggest the movement is waning and suspect the groups' menacing stance and claims of 3,000 members are bluster. Billé thinks there is "a lot of posturing".
"We have heard of instances [of violence]. They are not necessarily all right or all wrong," said Javkhlan, a Tsagaan Khass leader. But the group is simply a "law enforcement" body, he maintained: "We do checks; we go to hotels and restaurants to make sure Mongolian girls don't do prostitution and foreigners don't break the laws.
"We don't go through and beat the sht out of everyone. We check our information and make sure it's true."
They rely on police and media pressure to reform such businesses, he added. And if that failed? "We try to avoid using power," he said. "That would be our very last resort."

Mongolian neo-Nazis: Anti-Chinese sentiment fuels rise of ultra-nationalism | World news | The Guardian

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Sweden's far-right party gains support


The United Minds-Cint poll, published in the Aftonbladet daily, handed the Sweden Democrats (SD) a record 6.5 percent support -- well above the four percent threshold for entering parliament.


Nearly 46 percent of people intended to vote for the ruling centre-right coalition while 45 percent said they would vote for the left-wing opposition coalition, the poll of 2,004 people between July 12 and August 1 showed.


With less than a percentage point difference between the two main blocs, the right-wing SD party, which has never before made it into parliament, would likely become the kingmaker of the election, observers said.



"It is probable that we will have a very messy parliamentary situation after the election," Carl Melin of United Minds told the paper.


The four parties in the centre-right coalition and the three main leftist opposition parties have ruled out cooperating with SD but observers say it could be difficult to block the far-right party from the decision-making process.


The Sweden Democrats leader, Jimmie Åkesson, said he was convinced the two main blocs would rethink their stance as his party gains in popularity.


"They don't want to give up their power in the parliament, that is what is most important for them," he told the news agency TT.


If either bloc manages to secure a parliamentary majority, SD would not make much difference, political scientist Peter Santesson-Wilson of the Ratio research institute in Stockholm told AFP.


However, "a minority government would be very unstable if it refused to ever vote with (SD)," he said, pointing out that the party could for instance choose to vote on the opposition's, rather than the minority government's, budget proposal.


"That would cause political chaos and the government would quickly be forced to resign," he said.


The Sweden Democrats won just 2.9 percent of the vote in the country's last elections in 2006. The party argues that Sweden should remain a "homogeneous society" by drastically cutting the numbers of immigrants.


Sweden's far-right party gains support

Holy cow, if those pesky Swedes can support Nationalism.... HOLY COW!!

p.s. Much of Europe isnt too far behind Sweden.

 

[rambone]

As I understand outside the Western world, Nazism is not looked upon so bad, but still.

Really?

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Really?

It is my understanding, speculation and definitely not fact.

 

[gunman]

mongolian nazis quite possibly dumber than white nazis

 

[sepe]

Tsagaan Khass points out that the swastika is an ancient Asian symbol <---- THAT IS A LIE - NHV)

I really hope that wasn't you putting in the THAT IS A LIE thing. If so, you might need to learn about the origins of the swastika. If it isn't an ancient Asian symbol then there were some misinformed Buddhist back around the 5th century BCE. There is evidence of even earlier use by MANY others. And yes, there is evidence of early usage of the swastika facing both clockwise and counter-clockwise.

 

[Hammerhead]

The swastika is actually at least 5000 years old, having been used long before Hitler ever locked onto it.

From the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum.

That article does state "Asian" and not specifically "Chinese" or "Mongolian". The USHMM calls it "Neolithic Eurasia" and having been used as far back as Sanskrit, which is one of the earliest known forms of writing.

Even the Jewish Virtual Library acknowledges that the swastika was used in Asian cultures, even being flipped counterclockwise in ancient China.

The article didn't state that it originated in Asia. It seems to me it was used all over Eurasia, including ancient Greece (as evident of findings of artifacts from ancient Troy) Germania, and as used in Buddhism and Hinduism. All as noted in both links above. According to another link I read, what could be seen as one of the earliest known books has an image of Buddha with the swastika on it.

There is no lie. Adolf Hitler did not create the symbol, it was in use as a good luck symbol among other things before the meaning was twisted.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Tsagaan Khass points out that the swastika is an ancient Asian symbol <---- THAT IS A LIE - NHV)

I really hope that wasn't you putting in the THAT IS A LIE thing. If so, you might need to learn about the origins of the swastika.

If it isn't an ancient Asian symbol then there were some misinformed Buddhist back around the 5th century BCE.

There is evidence of even earlier use by MANY others. And yes, there is evidence of early usage of the swastika facing both clockwise and counter-clockwise.

LMAO

I can certainly tell you are very new here; So I'll keep this very short; Consider it a lession
Archaeologists Unearth 7,000-Year-Old Swastika in North-western Bulgaria

Balkan Travellers - Archaeologists Unearth 7,000-Year-Old Swastika in North-western Bulgaria

The oldest record of the swastika comes from artifacts unearthed in modern-day Iran dating back 7,000 years.

Did the Swastika Symbol Really Originate in Some Eastern Religions?
===================================

So the oldest Swastika's are found outside of Asia, suggest that these symbols are..... Asian?

FORGET IT.

The Swastika is a Solar symbol. Asians WERE NOT originally a solar people, the Indo-Europeans were, not to be confused with Old Line European.

Buddhism has NOTHING to do with Asians, although it's adoption is undoubtedly obvious. Buddhism is a 'bastardized' version of the Vedic religion, or the Indian version - Hindu.

===================================


Siddhārtha Gautama, or Buddha, the founder of Buddhism, who you are undoubtedly refering to in your post is about as far from being an Asian/Indian as one could be.
He was not born a begger, or commoner. He was born of a High Caste, as many may know.

The Aryans or Indo-Europeans exercised a 3 tier caste system. Priest, Kings/warriors & Farmer/merchants; When the IE people invaded encountered non-IE people such as the dravidians (Indians), they subjected them to a new caste, the Untouchables, any admixture was STRICTLY forbidden.

Buddha, was born of the King/Warrior caste, so it's quite obvious that any non-IE admixture is HIGHLY unlikely. Nevermind the physical descriptions suggest this, too.

Buddha undoubtedly, displeased with the Caste system, set out to pioneer something new, Buddhism.

So again.... Explain how the Swastika is asian.

Physical characteristics of the Buddha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Gautama Buddha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

===================================


I dont want to pretend Im a know it all; But these are certainly the facts as I know them. I am aware the symbol is found far and wide, and my only theory is that there was obvious cross cultural contact.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

The swastika is actually at least 5000 years old, having been used long before Hitler ever locked onto it.

From the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum.

That article does state "Asian" and not specifically "Chinese" or "Mongolian". The USHMM calls it "Neolithic Eurasia" and having been used as far back as Sanskrit, which is one of the earliest known forms of writing.

Even the Jewish Virtual Library acknowledges that the swastika was used in Asian cultures, even being flipped counterclockwise in ancient China.

The article didn't state that it originated in Asia. It seems to me it was used all over Eurasia, including ancient Greece (as evident of findings of artifacts from ancient Troy) Germania, and as used in Buddhism and Hinduism. All as noted in both links above. According to another link I read, what could be seen as one of the earliest known books has an image of Buddha with the swastika on it.

There is no lie. Adolf Hitler did not create the symbol, it was in use as a good luck symbol among other things before the meaning was twisted.

Your article is wrong, but not surprising.

Citing a Jewish holocaust memorial site is akin to citing the Black Panthers to the symbolage of the Confederate battle flag, and then say it's a French flag.


The only reason the Swastika would be found in Asia, is because of an IE presence in Western/central Asia.


Google Tocherians, Scythians and various other peoples who went into Asia, and supported the massive trade market.

 

[rambone]

LMAO

I can certainly tell you are very new here; So I'll keep this very short; Consider it a lession
Archaeologists Unearth 7,000-Year-Old Swastika in North-western Bulgaria

Balkan Travellers - Archaeologists Unearth 7,000-Year-Old Swastika in North-western Bulgaria

The oldest record of the swastika comes from artifacts unearthed in modern-day Iran dating back 7,000 years.

You're kind of touchy about the History of Nazi symbols. You gave me lesson too, when I posted something with the SS emblem on it.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Would you like it if someone kept promoting the wrong idea about your religious symbol. I try not to be touchy, or appear that way, only educate.

Nazis used alot of symbolism of the ancient IE religions, Runes, Solar Crosses; Since then it's been acceptable to attack those symbols, that is until NordicHeathenVinlander came around lol

But it begs the question does wrong ever equal right?

I like those "WHY SO" depictions, then again, I thought the Joker ruled in the new Batman movie.

 

[Hammerhead]

Again, I didn't say. nor did the text in the article you posted, that it originated in Asia, but that it was an ancient Asian symbol.

Are not Iran and India considered part of "Asia" as a continent? Being used across the whole continent by many different peoples as both of the links I provided suggest, would make it not only ancient Asian, but also ancient Greek and ancient Turkish. Wait, wasn't there some guy named Ghengis Kahn that ruled a vast empire from the east coast of China all the way into Europe? Widespread usage is not uncommon.

I wasn't focusing on the origin, I was focusing on the widespread use. Again, it is not surprising that it's considered an ancient symbol by many cultures.

And I only cited those links as they're much more credible than Yahoo answers or some stupid "white history" links that came up in my search. This is an issue that I've educated myself about before.

ETA: It's entirely possible that the person quoted in your OP could have meant that it was originally and ancient Asian symbol, trying to tie his current idiocy and worship to his ancestry. However, as printed, I saw his comment differently.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Again, I didn't say. nor did the text in the article you posted, that it originated in Asia, but that it was an ancient Asian symbol.

OK, define "Asia" & "Asian" & "Origininated".

Are not Iran and India considered part of "Asia" as a continent?

I suppose it depends. I believe the Ancients considered what is now Turkey to be Asia.
But to be honest, this geography matters NOT.

To say it is an "Asian" symbol gives credit to Asians people for something that is not due them.

Being used across the whole continent by many different peoples as both of the links I provided suggest, would make it not only ancient Asian, but also ancient Greek and ancient Turkish.

It's origins is IE. Just like Indians, Asians, Amerindians, Africans can use it, but it does not mean it is a symbol that originates with them, that is silly to say

Wait, wasn't there some guy named Ghengis Kahn that ruled a vast empire from the east coast of China all the way into Europe?

LORD HELP ME.

I wish you didnt bring up Gengis Khan.

I'll copy/paste my past findings here.

No accurate portraits of Genghis exist today, and any surviving depictions are considered to be artistic interpretations. Persian historian Rashid-al-Din recorded in his "Chronicles" that the legendary "glittering" ancestor of Genghis was tall, long-bearded, red-haired, and green-eyed. Rashid al-Din also described the first meeting of Genghis and Kublai Khan, when Genghis was shocked to find that Kublai had not inherited his red hair.


Also according to al-Din Genghis's Borjigid clan, had a legend involving their origins: it began as the result of an affair between Alan-ko and a stranger to her land, a glittering man who happened to have red hair and bluish-green eyes.

Genghis Khan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



The Alans were an Iranic/Scythian people. Remember that, please.

THE SECRET HISTORY OF THE MONGOLS


The Secret History of the Mongols is the only genuine Mongolian account of Chinggis Khan (Genghis Khan) and his family's history and was most likely assembled a few decades after his death in 1227.




Further, Alan Qo'a addressed these words of
admonition to her five sons:

THE SECRET HISTORY OF THEMONGOLS


So how did you just help your case?

Tarim mummies - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archaeologists Find 2,500-Year-Old Mummy In Mongolia, Tattos And All (Blonde Headed Scythian)



Bare in mind, Im keeping this post VERY short, and to the point, concern Khan.

Widespread usage is not uncommon.

I am not contesting that, but the ORIGIN.

I wasn't focusing on the origin, I was focusing on the widespread use. Again, it is not surprising that it's considered an ancient symbol by many cultures.

Then this our miscommunication You were focusing on something I was not.

Frith.

And I only cited those links as they're much more credible than Yahoo answers or some stupid "white history" links that came up in my search. This is an issue that I've educated myself about before.

Why is "White history" stupid? By White History, Im not suggesting Nazis or the like, but simply the fact that Zorastinian, Vedicism, Buddhism are considered "white" in origin, and therefore history, and readily available to explain the Swastika with zero Nazi properganda.

ETA: It's entirely possible that the person quoted in your OP could have meant that it was originally and ancient Asian symbol, trying to tie his current idiocy and worship to his ancestry. However, as printed, I saw his comment differently.

Ah, I see your point, and understand. I think I faulted by reading what he said, wrongly.

 

[dross]

You're kind of touchy about the History of Nazi symbols. You gave me lesson too, when I posted something with the SS emblem on it.

It's not what you think, okay? Two and two can equal five.

 

[Stickfight]

What "credit" accrues to Asians in general, or any particular Asian, if it can be shown that 5000 years ago someone living in what we now call Asia or with a similar skin tone was the first to draw 6 straight lines in a given configuration? Could they buy a cup of coffee with it?

Which is why "white" history is stupid. Not history in general, but trying to break it down by skin color. As if you could know the shade of some guy's skin who died hundreds of years before the camera was invented or even if you could that his accomplishments should be used as a source of racial pride.

You are one man. Presumably white due to the happenstance that both of your parents are white. You are who you are based on what you and you alone (mostly) do. What some other man does, whether his skin is the same color as yours or not, has no bearing and doesn't decide if you can share some of his "credit".

And to preempt the reciprocal argument, yes it is equally stupid that some random black person takes tremendous pride in some other black person inventing open heart surgery, or the like.

 

[dross]

What "credit" accrues to Asians in general, or any particular Asian, if it can be shown that 5000 years ago someone living in what we now call Asia or with a similar skin tone was the first to draw 6 straight lines in a given configuration? Could they buy a cup of coffee with it?

Which is why "white" history is stupid. Not history in general, but trying to break it down by skin color. As if you could know the shade of some guy's skin who died hundreds of years before the camera was invented or even if you could that his accomplishments should be used as a source of racial pride.

You are one man. Presumably white due to the happenstance that both of your parents are white. You are who you are based on what you and you alone (mostly) do. What some other man does, whether his skin is the same color as yours or not, has no bearing and doesn't decide if you can share some of his "credit".

And to preempt the reciprocal argument, yes it is equally stupid that some random black person takes tremendous pride in some other black person inventing open heart surgery, or the like.

Good post.

If you're proud of what people of like pigmentation do that is good, don't you have to be ashamed in equal amounts for what they do that's bad?

Nothing anyone else does (except my three year old daughter) is any reflection on me whatsoever. Good or bad.

Judging an individual because he is a part of a group is just a form of collectivism, a very backwoods, inbred, intellectually inferior form of collectivism. People who do so are disgusting. I spit on them.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

What is this "pride" talk all about?


Tell a Jew that it was really Asians who are the original Hebrews.

Tell a Black person, that Nubia was really White in origin.


Watch the responses.
===================================

I have no use for 'skin pigmintation' folks... This is the misconception on Race, that everything is skin deep, which is NOT scientifically factual.

Does Black skin make Black people run faster?

Does Whitish skin make White & Asians swim faster?

Im sure the list goes from there concerning race.

Stickfight, You are aware that Science can infact determine Race by Skeletal remains, from thousands of years ago?

Standing up for historical facts, is not a matter of "sharing" credit, but being CORRECT.

If someone told you your $5 was worth $1, would you accept it, even though you knew it to be false? Simple logic, folks.

Accepting PC liberal feel goodism is backwards, illogical and ultimately WRONG.

You can either be right or wrong, the choice is one that the individual will need to accept.

 

[88GT]

What is this "pride" talk all about?


Tell a Jew that it was really Asians who are the original Hebrews.

Tell a Black person, that Nubia was really White in origin.


Watch the responses.
===================================

I have no use for 'skin pigmintation' folks... This is the misconception on Race, that everything is skin deep, which is NOT scientifically factual.

Does Black skin make Black people run faster?

Does Whitish skin make White & Asians swim faster?

Im sure the list goes from there concerning race.

Stickfight, You are aware that Science can infact determine Race by Skeletal remains, from thousands of years ago?

Standing up for historical facts, is not a matter of "sharing" credit, but being CORRECT.

If someone told you your $5 was worth $1, would you accept it, even though you knew it to be false? Simple logic, folks.

Accepting PC liberal feel goodism is backwards, illogical and ultimately WRONG.

You can either be right or wrong, the choice is one that the individual will need to accept.

And let's not forget that there are only THREE races. We should tell that to the census bureau.

 

[Stickfight]

You are aware that Science can infact determine Race by Skeletal remains, from thousands years ago

Not in the sense that you use race, no they don't. Anthropologists describe race as discrete population origin. Your use of "white" shows you aren't in the same ballpark.

I've lost count of how many threads you've done this in, been called out, then fallen back on the claim that when you say white you don't mean white but some general geographic origin.

And this facade of you just blindly pursuing the truth isn't fooling even the dimmest among us. Nearly every 'fact' you happen across is somehow related to race.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Not in the sense that you use race, no they don't. Anthropologists describe race as discrete population origin. Your use of "white" shows you aren't in the same ballpark.

Explain the differences.

I've lost count of how many threads you've done this in, been called out, then fallen back on the claim that when you say white you don't mean white but some general geographic origin.

I dont believe I've been called out on the race issue, simply because I've never hit the issue as strongly as it could be struck.

Again, Im failing to understand how geography would relate to race, please eleborate for me what it is you are suggesting.

And this facade of you just blindly pursuing the truth isn't fooling even the dimmest among us. Nearly every 'fact' you happen across is somehow related to race.

Race is an issue I find amazing to research. Sorry if these truths dont hold up to liberal feel goodism logic.