Veterinary Medicines / SHTF ?

[2ADMNLOVER]

Do we have any *TRAINED MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS* vets , pharm techs who can answer questions about meds ?

From what I can tell from the FDA's website there may be some differences between the manufacturing of human and animal meds but it doesn't say if meds are safe for interspecies consumption .

Rather convenient I think .

I was on a veterinary medicine supply site and noticed products similar to human meds such as Cephelxin , generic for Keflex a broad spectrum antibiotic .

It was labeled for fish instead of humans but it comes in pill form just like it would for humans same dosages and all .

HMMM . What gives ?

 

[Jack Ryan]

I'd recomend learning as much as you can right now about any animals you plan to need or have.

Vet's now days are just not the same "vet" we knew 20-30 years ago just like medicine for humans is not the same service it used to be.

Even from one vet to another today there can be huge "differences" in what they can or will do and the type and number of animals they are familiar with.

I just with in the last few weeks tossed in the towel with a vet I've been using for about ten years now and I'll never go back. He had me giving up and already digging the hole for my dog. I finally just decided he wasn't in much pain so I was going to the internet and common sense and treat him for what made sense to me. He was as good in his grave according to the vet I spent a couple hundred dollars with for that great advice.

A couple hours later I was doping this dog with heavy doses of cranberry juice, green tea, and heavy doses of Saw Palmetto.

He may still be an old dog but by golly he's chasing the big brown truck up and down the driveway and has the driver convinced he's still full of vinegar.

 

[redneckmedic]

I talked extensively with my vet about SHTF and using vet supplies. Here is what he told me. Sutures are just fine no biggie, use as you would for human stuff, endo for endo and trilene for trilene, excreta. I know that you can buy fish antibiotics (amoxicillian OTC) which would work for humans too in a SHTF for certain kinds of infections. Dosing is your biggest problem, but you can look that up, just make sure you get it on paper, cause you can't find it once the grid goes down.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

Dosing is your biggest problem, but you can look that up, just make sure you get it on paper, cause you can't find it once the grid goes down.

Thats what I'm getting at . I figure between my Merck , PDR and others I can figure it out .

 

[Jack Ryan]

Thats what I'm getting at . I figure between my Merck , PDR and others I can figure it out .

Be sure to come back and let us know if they actually get you this with out any prescription. I'm listening closer now.

How do you get a fish to take a pill any way?

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

Be sure to come back and let us know if they actually get you this with out any prescription. I'm listening closer now.

How do you get a fish to take a pill any way?

calvetsupply.com , it clearly says right on the page , no prescription needed .

 

[Woodsman]

How do you get a fish to take a pill any way?

They are suppositories.

Seriously though, I think this is very interesting and am interested in hearing more on developments.

 

[Clay]

my parents are vets, so first things first...... if the SHTF, Ill have all the meds long before you do hehe

now, from what Ive gathered over the years, most of the drugs my parents use are either (a) actual human drugs, or (b) the same drugs as human drugs, but packaged for animal use. There are some animal specific drugs out there as well, but like I said, most are human drugs. Your biggest advantage is making sure you know the proper name for drugs and not the 'brand name'. None of the meds in a vets office are known by their brand name, only their proper name. (ie diphenhydramine = Benedryl).

as for dosing, the dosing levels are not on the bottle, so again, your going to have to know what the dosing is for humans, or for dogs, or fish etc. Its not going to be given to you on the bottle.

 

[Royal-1]

I was on a veterinary medicine supply site and noticed products similar to human meds such as Cephelxin , generic for Keflex a broad spectrum antibiotic .

It was labeled for fish instead of humans but it comes in pill form just like it would for humans same dosages and all .

HMMM . What gives ?

Specifically check out this site. Several pages of info, and they do have dosages listed for specific ills.

I'm going to run my printer ink dry.....again.

 

[CPU13rother]

calvetsupply.com , it clearly says right on the page , no prescription needed .

Sad they don't sell "local"

 

[mrjarrell]

My local Tractor Supply used to sell animal drugs. I'll have to look and see if they still do. That may be one local source for folks.

 

[CPU13rother]

My local Tractor Supply used to sell animal drugs. I'll have to look and see if they still do. That may be one local source for folks.

hehe sorry to confuse, that's not the kind of local I was referring

 

[redneckmedic]

Dosing is easy... if you do a little research in the pharmacist isle (read on line or get a 1st addition book) .... drugs go by weight, just get yourself a scale. Must be in mcg mg and grams though, so yeah its going to be small.

BTW fish meds are powder just like food you just sprinkle it in. You know you can lead a fish to water but you can't...oh never mind.

 

[Six Forty-Two]

The main difference between human and animal products is the standards that the FDA has for production. One thing to remember is that brand names are often different for human and animal products. For example, taking cephalexin capsules intended for fish wouldn't be my first choice, it won't harm you.

I was looking at some of the online vet supply stores and the tablets and capsules for fish are the same strengths (mg) that are used in humans. The difference is that when dosing fish, you are diluting the powder in the capsule into a large tank of water to treat several fish. In humans, the drug is diluted throughout the body.

If you do buy one of these products, look up the human doses based on whatever type of infection you anticipate (i.e. skin, respiratory, etc.). If you take any other medications regularly, you may want to check with your pharmacist or doctor to see if there are any drug interactions to worry about.

Also, a scale would not be very helpful for measuring out the medication since the capsules are already in the correct dose for humans. If you are needing to dose for children and have the corect dosing for the child's weight, you can open up the capsule and eyeball a fraction of the powder.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

Look what I've found !

The Pill Book (13th Edition) by Harold M. Silverman - BestBookDeal

VetAmerica - Fish Supplies - Antibiotics

Welcome to AQUA-PRODUCTS Fish and Aquatic Medications


Looks like some good sources .

 

[Jack Ryan]

Did you order any of these or use them yet?

I'm ordering Cephalexin today for use with my dog and an infection.

It's not cheap but at least I didn't have to pay the "gate keeper" for what I already know I need and I did get double the quantity of medicine I usually get with an Rx.

Here's hoping he doesn't grow scales and start breathing under water.

 

[Jack Ryan]

I got this order two days ago.

Tested one cap in warm water to see if it would disolve and it started getting all gummy and soft in just water so I'm calling that a non issue.

Not the RIGHT way to start on antibiotics but it is the right way to test the effect of unknown drug effects...

Gave him one 250 pill the first morning to no ill effect, dosed him with a 500 that evening. Again to no ill effect, so this morning and evening I gave him the full 750 dose the vet was prescribing still with no ill effect and he is starting to get more active and fiesty just like he does when he feels better from the vet's Rx treatment.

Planning a 2 week course of treatment as is normal and I'll still have enough meds for another 2 weeks the next time the issue comes up.

So far I'm calling this a good plan.

 

[MarkR]

Ok, I've used these resources for a couple of years. Here's what I've found about Vet antibiotics such as for "fish" or "birds". They are packaged as capsules that you must break apart to put in the water (for fish), and they conveniently come in dosages that are standard doses for human indications i.e. Cephalexin in 250mg or 500mg capsules. The same can be said for Amoxicillin, Ampicillin, Cephalexin, Tetracycline, Doxycycline, and a host of others. Make sure that the product says "Human Grade" even though it is for "Veterinary Use Only". Also, make sure that it is manufactured in the USA. If it's an American product, it's much more likely to be legitimate, and pass US standards. Otherwise, you could get a counterfeit drug, or worse...
These do work, and they are great to have as a SHTF supply.

 

[evansvillethompsongunner]

Ok, I've used these resources for a couple of years. Here's what I've found about Vet antibiotics such as for "fish" or "birds". They are packaged as capsules that you must break apart to put in the water (for fish), and they conveniently come in dosages that are standard doses for human indications i.e. Cephalexin in 250mg or 500mg capsules. The same can be said for Amoxicillin, Ampicillin, Cephalexin, Tetracycline, Doxycycline, and a host of others. Make sure that the product says "Human Grade" even though it is for "Veterinary Use Only". Also, make sure that it is manufactured in the USA. If it's an American product, it's much more likely to be legitimate, and pass US standards. Otherwise, you could get a counterfeit drug, or worse...
These do work, and they are great to have as a SHTF supply.

I've kind of commented on this [the necessity of having prescriptions during SHTF] in another thread.....

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...2-show_us_your_bag-post655300.html#post655300



Even if the efficacy were to be the same as animal antibiotics (and sometimes the manufacturing standards are as high as those for human antibiotics, sometimes not), it's still illegal to possess or ingest prescription drugs not written for the person ingesting them. Moreover, ingesting non-prescription animal drugs which are actually being used as prescriptions for people is also a crime. Not saying to do it, or not to do it if you feel you must, I'm just saying it's easier, safer, and legal to just squirrel away a few pills at a time when you get them filled for yourself.

 

[MarkR]

These are OTC veterinary products (even though they are the same strength as those requiring a prescription). They are OTC because they are specifically designated for use in birds or fish. They are NOT illegal to possess. It is illegal to DISPENSE prescription drugs without a license. These are not prescription drugs...
But your point is well taken. Everyone must make decisions for themselves, and we are discussing SHTF scenarios here.