Tax Money to Burn - Illegal Aliens to Get Stimulus Checks

[4sarge]

Stimulus Bill Would Give Payments to Illegal Aliens

Thursday, January 29, 2009

WASHINGTON - The $800 billion-plus economic stimulus measure making its way through Congress could steer government checks to illegal immigrants, a top Republican congressional official asserted Thursday.
The legislation, which would send tax credits of $500 per worker and $1,000 per couple, expressly disqualifies nonresident aliens, but it would allow people who don't have Social Security numbers to be eligible for the checks.

Undocumented immigrants who are not eligible for a Social Security number can file tax returns with an alternative number. A House-passed version of the economic recovery bill and one making its way through the Senate would allow anyone with such a number, called an individual taxpayer identification number, to qualify for the tax credits.

A revolt among GOP conservatives to similar provisions of a 2008 economic stimulus bill, which sent rebate checks to most wage earners, forced Democratic congressional leaders to add stricter eligibility requirements. That legislation, enacted in February 2008, required that people have valid Social Security numbers in order to get checks.

The GOP official voiced concerns about the latest economic aid measure on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss it publicly.

Republicans have already blasted the package for including what they argue is wasteful spending and omitting tax cuts for wealthier people and businesses they say are needed to jump-start the anemic economy.

Not a single Republican voted for an $819 billion version of the plan when it passed the House on Wednesday.

GOP senators arranged a midday news conference to voice their concerns.

 

[AllenM]

And the good news is ???

 

[4sarge]

And the good news is ???

That this is just a Bad Dream and we will all wake up or this train wreck will only last 4 long years. I'm not optimistic about either perspective

 

[haldir]

Just freaking shoot me... it was bad enough they wanted to give tax rebates to people that don't pay income tax now for the illegals... what the hell is wrong with these people...

 

[Dogman]

Not surprised at all.

 

[jeremy]

The ITN script is intended to benefit those in the military. When my wife and I first got married we applied for her ITN, then we applied for her Non-Resident Visa, SSN, Green Card, Etc...
The ITN is gotten in weeks not monthes, allowing you to file your spouse on your incoming taxes.
Under the last stimulus plan those soldiers who had spouses with ITN did not get a stimulus check for their spouse.

 

[finity]

The ITN script is intended to benefit those in the military. When my wife and I first got married we applied for her ITN, then we applied for her Non-Resident Visa, SSN, Green Card, Etc...
The ITN is gotten in weeks not monthes, allowing you to file your spouse on your incoming taxes.
Under the last stimulus plan those soldiers who had spouses with ITN did not get a stimulus check for their spouse.

Nice to have the truth come out. There always seems to be more to the story than what some would like you to think.

Should the headline read "GOP does not support the troops"? Thats just as silly as the original claim.

 

[jsgolfman]

What is ITN script?

 

[Hoosier Gun Coat]

Just freaking shoot me... it was bad enough they wanted to give tax rebates to people that don't pay income tax now for the illegals... what the hell is wrong with these people...

They are buying votes with our money.

 

[jeremy]

What is ITN script?

The verbage/ text of the bill in question.

 

[jeremy]

They are buying votes with our money.

They are trying to do the right thing for the military for once.

 

[jedi]

Just freaking shoot me... it was bad enough they wanted to give tax rebates to people that don't pay income tax now for the illegals... what the hell is wrong with these people...

A little 4-1-1 here before you all go crazy with this topics. However before I start let me say that I don't agree with giving a check to someone who is illegal even though they are paying into the system (social security).

Now re-read that again all of you. Now here is what they don't tell you and how some many jump all over the place on this topic.

Juan come into the US illegally from Mexico.

Juan pays some for a Social Security Number in CA since you can't get an IRS Tax number unless you are here legally.
(You can get SS numbers very eaisly in LA on just about any street corner or even a IRS Tax number.)

Juan takes as a janitor for company "Clean Boys".

The owner of CleanBoys pays Juan and pays the taxes based on the Social Security number that Juan gave him.

The US Government gets its share of Juan's taxes from "Clean Boys".

Juan gets FICA, MEDICARE, and STATE TAXES taken out each check.

All is good right? YES! from the eyes of the government.
Why? Simple you see while Juan is using that SSN number the government is getting "paid" it's share and since Juan will never be able to claim Social Security/Disabilty beneifts the government keeps that money. Now say Juan used 4Sarge's SSN and now 4Sarge is going to get retirement beneifts. Well guess what when Social Security awards 4Srage his beneifts they remove all those earnings that are not his and jut dump this into a huge "lost earnings database". Most of those earnings are never used again since Juan can not claim them.

So Uncle Sam and his little brothers in the states LOVE illegals since it gives them FREE MONEY they can then use for whatever!


Now there are other problems with Juan being in the US. He ay or may not have insurance but you can bet the house that he or his kids are going to need medical care, education, etc. at some point and well since he is not "really" paying taxes you foot some of that bil with your own taxes.

What do I mean by him not paying taxes? Yes Juan has taxes begin taken out of his check like you and me but he is probably not filing an 1040 in April so he may owe additional taxes that the government is never going to collect. At the same time the government may have taken too much money but alas Juan is not going to get it either.

So it's a double edge sword for Juan but one they are willing to take.
Now you may ask why not just stop this at the employee or SSA agency.

One word: MANPOWER

There is not enough people and there is no way to have enough people to watch this. Technonolgy has failed us here as well. Becuase while technoolgy may tell us that Juan's name does not match up with the records since it's IRS job to report it to ICE and then ICE's job to deport why bother. IRS is happy getting money from Juan for FREE and ICE has much bigger fish to dry than go after 1 person. Thus Juan gets to stay and even if they do go after him by the time they get to him Juan maybe in NY instead of CA or may have moved all over the country. Not to mention how do you find him when the SSN is being used all over the country on a yearly basis.

Food for though for you all...

 

[4sarge]

A little 4-1-1 here before you all go crazy with this topics. However before I start let me say that I don't agree with giving a check to someone who is illegal even though they are paying into the system (social security).

Now re-read that again all of you. Now here is what they don't tell you and how some many jump all over the place on this topic.

Juan come into the US illegally from Mexico. Juan should not be here illegally

Juan pays some for a Social Security Number in CA since you can't get an IRS Tax number unless you are here legally. Illegally obtaining False ID
(You can get SS numbers very easily in LA on just about any street corner or even a IRS Tax number.) Arrest & Prosecute those selling False ID

Juan takes as a janitor for company "Clean Boys". Clean Boys are Illegally hiring Juan - Prosecute Clean Boys

The owner of CleanBoys pays Juan and pays the taxes based on the Social Security number that Juan gave him. Maybe

The US Government gets its share of Juan's taxes from "Clean Boys". or Clean Boys is paying Juan under the table cash and by passing all taxes and Juan is being paid a sub standard wage.

Juan gets FICA, MEDICARE, and STATE TAXES taken out each check. Maybe

All is good right? YES! from the eyes of the government.
Why? Simple you see while Juan is using that SSN number the government is getting "paid" it's share and since Juan will never be able to claim Social Security/Disability benefits the government keeps that money.

Now say Juan used 4Sarge's SSN and now 4Sarge is going to get retirement benefits. Well guess what when Social Security awards 4Srage his benefits they remove all those earnings that are not his and jut dump this into a huge "lost earnings database". Most of those earnings are never used again since Juan can not claim them. Except 4sarge Does Not want anyone using his SSN fictitiously and or potential problems with the IRS for wages earned by another and Not earned or reported by 4sarge

So Uncle Sam and his little brothers in the states LOVE illegals since it gives them FREE MONEY they can then use for whatever! 2 Wrongs do not make a Right


Now there are other problems with Juan being in the US. He ay or may not have insurance but you can bet the house that he or his kids are going to need medical care, education, etc. at some point and well since he is not "really" paying taxes you foot some or ALL of that bill with your own taxes.

What do I mean by him not paying taxes? Yes Juan has taxes begin taken out of his check like you and me but he is probably not filing an 1040 in April so he may owe additional taxes that the government is never going to collect. At the same time the government may have taken too much money but alas Juan is not going to get it either. Unless Juan is being Paid CASH

So it's a double edge sword for Juan but one they are willing to take.
Now you may ask why not just stop this at the employee or SSA agency.

One word: MANPOWER - The Government FAILED us and Juan by Failing to Enforce Immigration Laws and allowing Juan to stay and work here Illegally thus multiplying the problem exponentially

There is not enough people and there is no way to have enough people to watch this. Technology has failed us here as well. Because while technology may tell us that Juan's name does not match up with the records since it's IRS job to report it to ICE and then ICE's job to deport why bother. IRS is happy getting money from Juan for FREE and ICE has much bigger fish to dry than go after 1 person. Thus Juan gets to stay and even if they do go after him by the time they get to him Juan maybe in NY instead of CA or may have moved all over the country. Not to mention how do you find him when the SSN is being used all over the country on a yearly basis. No problem is unsolvable. The Government has failed us and Juan but that is not an excuse to not enforce existing law

Food for though for you all...

See Above

Strict Term Limits for All Politicians
Flat Tax
Abolish Property Taxes
Strong Support for the 2nd Amendment and require our lawmakers to abide by the US Constitution

 

[jedi]

Yes there are some JUANs that get paid in CASH and thus the above example does not work for them. There are many more JUANs using SSNs that do not belong to them and are paying into the system that they will never get back from nor we (any US citizen that pays into the system) as all that money goes unclaimed and into the coffers of Uncle Sam. I'm not defending Juan. he is a criminal for a) coming illegal and obtaining false ID but he is the bottom of the barrel in this mess.

Should "CleanBoys" get prosecuted. Sure but lack of resources is going to stop that. In addition "CleanBoys" will claim no knowledge as the SSN did work and SSA did provide verification that is was valid. Any even if SSA says it's invalid some 12+ months later by that point Juan will have moved on. Thus you end up chasing ghost.

Not to mention SSA, ICE and IRS are not really talking about this issue. SSA is not worry about it since Juan is not trying to collect beneifts. IRS is happy taxing someone even if the SSA number is incorrect. ICE is not going to waste time going after 1 person when they can next 100+ at the next factory. Local PD have no jursidication since Juan is not doing anything "illegal" at the time. Yes he is here illegally but they cannot deport him. So Local PD calls ICE and all ICE does is talk name/phone/address and says thanks. ICE again won't pick up just 1 person (the cost outwieghts the benefit from there point of view).

Thus the entire system is BROKEN and since the critters in DC are too push printing more money they don't care either.

 

[4sarge]

Yes there are some JUANs that get paid in CASH and thus the above example does not work for them. There are many more JUANs using SSNs that do not belong to them And they shouldn't be here to be taken advantage of and are paying into the system that they will never get back from nor we (any US citizen that pays into the system) as all that money goes unclaimed and into the coffers of Uncle Sam. I'm not defending Juan. he is a criminal for a) coming illegal and obtaining false ID but he is the bottom of the barrel in this mess. Whether it's Juan, Wong fu, Peter, or Muhammad, if they are in the US illegally and unsupervised then they need to leave until applying and be granted legal entry status in realistic numbers that the US can sustain. We are on a sinking ship economically and Uncle Sam has allowed it's back to be broken and we are sinking fast but someone forgot the life boats.

Should "CleanBoys" get prosecuted. Sure but lack of resources is going to stop that. In addition "CleanBoys" will claim no knowledge as the SSN did work and SSA did provide verification that is was valid. Any even if SSA says it's invalid some 12+ months later by that point Juan will have moved on. Thus you end up chasing ghost.

Not to mention SSA, ICE and IRS are not really talking about this issue. It should be one of their top priorities. The SSA is not worry about it since Juan is not trying to collect benefits. IRS is happy taxing someone even if the SSA number is incorrect. ICE is not going to waste time going after 1 person when they can next 100+ at the next factory. Local PD have no jurisdiction since Juan is not doing anything "illegal" at the time. Yes he is here illegally but they cannot deport him. So Local PD calls ICE and all ICE does is talk name/phone/address and says thanks. ICE again won't pick up just 1 person (the cost outweighs the benefit from there point of view). Wrong point of view on their part and the local & state PD's should be empowered to take enforcement action

Thus the entire system is BROKEN and since the critters in DC are too push printing more money they don't care either. It's a sad state of affairs that the US Government has allowed us to be in without proper regulation and enforcement of existing law BUT we can NOT turn our back on what is right and what the current law is because our government is ineffective intentionally

See Above

I support legal immigration with realistic numbers imposed but with the caveat that anyone applying for citizenship be

1. Are at least 18 years old and a lawful permanent resident ("green card" holder);
[SIZE=-1]2. Have resided continuously in the United States, having been lawfully admitted for permanent residence, for five years immediately preceding the date you filed your application for naturalization, or[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]3. Have, after having been removed from conditional permanent resident status, based upon your marriage to a U.S. citizen, having resided in the United States for one year after the date the condition was removed;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]4. Have resided continuously in the United States at all times after your application to the time and date of your admission for citizenship;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]5. Have, during all periods of time referred to above, been and still are a person of good moral character;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]6. Have no outstanding deportation or removal order and no pending deportation or removal proceeding;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]7. Have the ability to read, write, speak, and understand simple words and phrases in English;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]8. Have knowledge and understanding of the fundamentals of U.S. history and government;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]9. Are attached to, and can support, the principles of the U.S. Constitution and can swear allegiance to the United States.[/SIZE]

 

[jedi]

Sadly sarge neither the DEMs or REPs have the courage to take on this issue and truly fix it. Just like neither is willing to fix Social Security. The Government Accountabilty Office has been reporting since 2000 (perhaps even before than but that is when I started tracking it) that MEDICARE will be in the red by 2017 and that the social security fund will be at $0.00 by 2047. Congress knows this, heck McCain during the campaign asked point-blank "No there will be none unless the laws change" when asked by a young girl if she would be able to collect Social Security. Yes Congress won't address the issue. Won't becuase it's political suicide just like immigration and gun control.

Any congressperson that says we should abolishs the MG law would never be re-elected, just like any congressperson that pushs pro/con for immigration or ssa. It is right. No but alas that is the state our of political system and country and thus why Uncle Sam is on life support and even if the offical doctor won't tell us we all know (search your heart) that no amount of medicine is going to bring Uncle Sam back.

Major, major, major changes have to happen but nobody in DC is willing to do it and the states are also not willing to do it. Which leaves The People who as of yet have not bothered to stop being sheep.

 

[4sarge]

Sadly sarge neither the DEMs or REPs have the courage to take on this issue and truly fix it. Just like neither is willing to fix Social Security. The Government Accountabilty Office has been reporting since 2000 (perhaps even before than but that is when I started tracking it) that MEDICARE will be in the red by 2017 and that the social security fund will be at $0.00 by 2047. Congress knows this, heck McCain during the campaign asked point-blank "No there will be none unless the laws change" when asked by a young girl if she would be able to collect Social Security. Yes Congress won't address the issue. Won't becuase it's political suicide just like immigration and gun control.

Any congressperson that says we should abolishs the MG law would never be re-elected, just like any congressperson that pushs pro/con for immigration or ssa. It is right. No but alas that is the state our of political system and country and thus why Uncle Sam is on life support and even if the offical doctor won't tell us we all know (search your heart) that no amount of medicine is going to bring Uncle Sam back.

Major, major, major changes have to happen but nobody in DC is willing to do it and the states are also not willing to do it. Which leaves The People who as of yet have not bothered to stop being sheep.

I'm in Total Agreement with most of your thoughts BUT I will Not let the Washington Politicans off so easy for being self serving incompetent, tax money thieving, "what's in it for me politicians". We must hold their feet to the fire and demand action. Unfortunately, you are correct that if something isn't done soon the US is on a downward spiral that we cannot come back from. Why do you think that the news media wanted a President like Barry, a one party Socialist system, a gun ban, a fairness doctrine and complete economic control over us. It's not a good thing

 

[haldir]

The Democrats and their willing accomplices in the press want more immigrants from Mexico, illegal or legal. They view that as a way to change the political balance in this country as most of these people vote for the party of entitlements. The Republicans are a bunch of pussies and won't really challenge it because they are afraid of upsetting the Hispanic voting bloc and also being called racists.