Question: New to bolt action rifles... need advice

[lucky4034]

Nearly have my 10/22 finished (just waiting on the barrel) and want to build a 700 precision rifle next.

I'm not rich (college student atm) but I'm patient and currently can free up a couple of hundred dollars a month.

The goal is to piece together a tacticool sniper rifle on either some sort of bolt action AR chasis or maybe a Accuracy International Chasis.... before I get that far (and that is very very FAR away) I have a couple of questions for the experts to help me understand my research.

Background... I've never shot a bolt action rifle. The farthest I've shot an AR-15 is out to about 250yds and that was only once. (obviously I plan to get out much further than that with this 700 build).

I have VERY limited knowledge on this subject and am trying to piece it all together so I can figure out whats the best course of action to get this show on the road, so please be patient and talk really really SLOWLY. Other than that, thanks in advance...

1. Initially the appeal of .338 Lapua hit me hard... until I figured out that ammo was 3-4 times as expensive as .308 and lets face it, at this point I'm such a long distance noob that .308 or .338 isn't going to make much difference. I probably couldn't hit a barn at 1000yds with either until I get a lot of practice in.

I'm thinking .308 is probably the best caliber for me at this time since its cheap and 50 times more capable than I.... am I right in this assessment? Is .308 a good caliber for a noob?

2. Assuming .308 is the right choice... from my understanding .308 is a "short action" caliber. (yes "short action" is a foreign term for me) as far as I can tell, Remington recievers/bolts come in a couple different configurations.... SA, LA and LA magnum (?). Does this mean that if I purchase a 700 in a SA caliber... lets say .223. The only thing I would need to get it to fire another SA caliber (.308) would be a barrel swap? If not... what else?

3. If 700 SA bolts are universal... and considering that it will take me many months to build my .308 the way I want it... I came across a youth model remington 700 in .243 for less than $400 brand new.... Could I (should I) use this youth model bolt action as the base for my build?

 

[Outlaw]

You could build one off of a Mauser action. Piece it together the way you want it right from the start. If your mechanically inclined its not that hard to do but you will need a gunsmith for some things.

Google image; custom Mauser 98 to get an idea of what you can do with them

 

[philbert001]

Your bolt will not be short action universal. think about the diameter of the base of a .223/5.56 round. the .308 base is at least 1/3 bigger diameter. the face of the bolt holds the rear of the cartridge.

 

[Yeah]

1. You are right about the barn
2. 308 Win is never the right choice, unless you don't have a choice.

Your most direct route is the 700 Youth is 243 Win you've already found. A trigger tweak, decent glass, mounts, and carefully chosen ammo, and you'll already be closer than you can get with a 308 Win. You'd be thinking of bullets first, action (its length and those effects), and letting the cartridge fall in line behind them.

A 0.243" 105 AMax pushed by a 243 Win annihilates anything 0.308" pushed by a 308 Win (or bigger...).

You'd also be in the game enough to get a taste having spent a little. If you stay in it, stock upgrades and barrels and optics and gear you can settle on as your skill dictates. Safes and closets and bedroom floors are littered with what some guy meticulously built up to be his perfect LR rifle, before he realized that the time and ammo cost to get that thing to reliably ring steel at great distances in too punitive. And there they sit on their first barrel.

Shoot first, buy stuff later.

 

[U.S. Patriot]

I do not want to sound like a jerk, so don't take it that way. What are your plans for the rifle? Are you planning on just punching paper? Maybe some high power competitions down the road? Possibly hunting as well? The reason I ask is this. I see a lot of people that want a precession tacticool sniper rifle. We are not snipers. Most people are not even good enough shots to get the full potential out of precession rifle. Don't be fooled thinking you need to spend a lot of money, you don't. Just something to think about. More $ does not always mean better.

 

[Eric86]

You will be better off buying an off the shelf Rem 700 SPS V in whatever cal you choose and start reloading for it. I have found that tailoring a load to a rifle "can" create a system that will be better than you are capable of. Most rifles today are much more accurate than the rifles of 50 years ago because there is much more precision involved. Each part is within thousands of an inch of eachother instead of each piece having to be filed down by the assembler. However this is not always the case, there will always be duds in a mass produced world.

If you decide to purchase an off the shelf rifle, remember you can always upgrade at any point provided you have the $$$. Some stocks are fairly cheap and will help the performance of said rifle. You dont have to spend a ton of money to have a precision rifle but you easily can do so. Are you trying to have an accurate rifle or something that is expensive and looks cool?

Last is that on a precision rifle you will need a good scope. Most quality ones start at $700 and up to $3,000.

 

[Eric86]

I do have a pretty good setup and dont get me wrong, I will eventually own a Krieger barrel, jewel trigger, and an AI stock. I just know I spent my money well with a $2k rifle and scope with $1k in reloading equipment/supplies than a $3k rifle and scope.

 

[42769vette]

i think 308 is the right choice for you. the 308 is the best at nothing but its good at everything. factory ammo is cheap and everywhere, if you decide to reload data and supplies are everywhere. the 338 lapua is close to the last caliber you should look at. right now trigger time is the most important thing to you meeting your goal and between the recoil and cost of ammo you wont get as much with the lapua as the 308.

short action is only 1/2 the equation. you will also have to make sure your rifle has the correct bolt face. here is a chart that will help with that. basically if the caliber you have, and action length you have matches all you need to do is rebarrel and you have a new caliber for the most part

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f37/bolt-face-diameters-36661/

also as eric mentioned optics is not the best place to skimp. if you cant see it you cant hit it, and if your scope is not doing exactly what it says it is then your range time will be filled with flusteration

 

[fireball168]

Safes and closets and bedroom floors are littered with what some guy meticulously built up to be his perfect LR rifle, before he realized that the time and ammo cost to get that thing to reliably ring steel at great distances in too punitive. And there they sit on their first barrel.

Shoot first, buy stuff later.

Amen

 

[avboiler11]

8541 Tactical - Budget Precision Build, M700 Tactical AAC-SD

Read this; it will point you in the right direction and provide a good path for future upgrades. I'd recommend the 700 AAC-SD in the above link, plus a Weaver or EGW 20MOA base, Burris XTR low rings, and the MidwayUSA exclusive Vortex Viper HS 5-15x44 mil/mil (have one of these myself, awesome optic for $400). Of course, you can go with the Bushnell 3200 10x for $200, or any number of quality used optics between those price points. Buy a bunch of Federal Gold Metal Match 175gr ammo from Palmetto State, and have at it.

As a point of reference to the Remington, however, I want to show you a Savage 10FP that I built last year.

Savage 10FP 4.4" action w/ Accutrigger: $220 (used from Savage Shooters)
Criterion 260 Rem 26" prefit barrel + recoil lug: $280 (Northland Shooter Supply)
Bell & Carlson A2 Medalist stock: $210 (Red Hawk Rifles)
Weaver 20MOA scope base: $30 (Amazon.com)
Burris XTR 30mm Low rings: $40 (used from SnipersHide)
Savage blind mag well, follower, L-clip: $15 (Savage Arms)

That's $800 for the rifle without optic, and you do all the work yourself with about $80 in additional tools (barrel nut wrench & go/no-go gages). And at any point in the future I can swap bolt heads to .532 for a WSM/SAUM or .378 for a 204/223 and barrels to whatever I want in less than 15 minutes.

 

[lucky4034]

I appreciate all the responses, information and advice.

As far as what I want to do with this build? Obviously initially I want to use it just for trigger time out of the box. Stock out of the box will keep me plenty busy and as I get more and more comfortable shooting at distance. I don't have any intended purpose for the rifle right now. Like golf, I plan on competing with myself... at least until I feel like I've gotten to the point that I can compete.

After I get the gun where I want it and feel like I have the fundamentals nailed, then competition could be a goal in the future for sure.

I'm so new to the idea that I haven't even researched competitions yet

 

[pitbull1]

I love this site! I spent several hours this weekend researching bolt action rifles. My answers could have been found here in less than 5 minutes! New home page incoming for me lol

Thanks for the link AV!

 

[lucky4034]

8541 Tactical - Budget Precision Build, M700 Tactical AAC-SD

Read this; it will point you in the right direction and provide a good path for future upgrades. I'd recommend the 700 AAC-SD in the above link, plus a Weaver or EGW 20MOA base, Burris XTR low rings, and the MidwayUSA exclusive Vortex Viper HS 5-15x44 mil/mil (have one of these myself, awesome optic for $400). Of course, you can go with the Bushnell 3200 10x for $200, or any number of quality used optics between those price points. Buy a bunch of Federal Gold Metal Match 175gr ammo from Palmetto State, and have at it.

As a point of reference to the Remington, however, I want to show you a Savage 10FP that I built last year.

Savage 10FP 4.4" action w/ Accutrigger: $220 (used from Savage Shooters)
Criterion 260 Rem 26" prefit barrel + recoil lug: $280 (Northland Shooter Supply)
Bell & Carlson A2 Medalist stock: $210 (Red Hawk Rifles)
Weaver 20MOA scope base: $30 (Amazon.com)
Burris XTR 30mm Low rings: $40 (used from SnipersHide)
Savage blind mag well, follower, L-clip: $15 (Savage Arms)

That's $800 for the rifle without optic, and you do all the work yourself with about $80 in additional tools (barrel nut wrench & go/no-go gages). And at any point in the future I can swap bolt heads to .532 for a WSM/SAUM or .378 for a 204/223 and barrels to whatever I want in less than 15 minutes.

Sweet link Exactly what I am looking for

 

[cwillour]

After I get the gun where I want it and feel like I have the fundamentals nailed, then competition could be a goal in the future for sure.

Just my , but don't bother waiting to start competing. Once you get somewhat comfortable with the gun you have (or get), go ahead and start competing w/ it in appropriate classes. You may do well or you may come in last, but I have found the folks to be generally friendly and helpful.

Also, you can also avoid spending serious $$ on equipment that is great for what you do not enjoy (i.e. building a bench rifle and finding you like matches focusing on traditional positions)

If you are planning on replacing everything but the receiver, the .243 bolt face is compatible w/ .308 so the youth model you are looking at would work. That being said, you may be better off finding a used .308 to start with since commercial .243 ammo runs a pretty penny compared to what you can find for .308 (Federal Gold Medal Match for <$20/20rds on sale, but this obviously does not matter if you are handloading.)

Lastly, if you have not done so yet, try to find the time to enjoy an Appleseed for some good general instruction on form and basic rifle marksmanship that is likely worth the investment in time and money.

And by all means, HAVE FUN!

 

[45fan]

Once again, I have to agree with 42769Vette. 308 Win isnt the best option for any one mission, but it is still VERY capable at many things. The wealth of information for this caliber, coupled with the price/quality of available factory ammo and reloading information/components makes it a great place to start. There are many other cartridges that might be more capable in different situations, but the .308 is at least as capable as the majority of shooters, and if you dont have time to reload, Match ammo isnt very difficult to find.
As far as a rifle, I started out looking for a Savage, with the 700 being my second choice. In the end, I went with a Rem 700 ADL varmint model, in .308 win. While the total package isnt exactly what I have in mind, it is more than capable of MOA accuracy, and $500 got my toe in the door, as Remington packages these rifles with a scope too. Its not the best setup for anything, but it will get you started, with what I think you are asking about, and give you the opportunity to evolve your setup to your tastes and liking as your budget allows.

 

[lucky4034]

Lastly, if you have not done so yet, try to find the time to enjoy an Appleseed for some good general instruction on form and basic rifle marksmanship that is likely worth the investment in time and money.

And by all means, HAVE FUN!

Thats funny... as you were typing this, I was looking up the nearest Appleseed. Found one in Niles MI this July less than 20miles from my house

Cheers

 

[Mechy]

I'll second (or third, maybe fourth) the vote for the .308, decent all around cartridge.

 

[42769vette]

If I can help with the scope let me know.

 

[lucky4034]

Appreciate it ... will be a while before I get some optics, but will definitely keep you in mind.

 

[Hookeye]

I'd look for a used Remington Sendero in .300 winmag