Question for the INGO computer guys

[Ruffnek]

I'm thinking about taking classes at Ivy Tech so that I can change careers because I'm sick of being a janitor and the shift sucks.I've always liked computers but I don't know much about them.I see jobs all the time for IT guys so it seems like this would be the job market to get into.Can anyone here that does this type of work offer some answers to these questions?

1: What kind of things can I do working on computers that pays well (at least $12+/hr)?
2: What types of classes should I take for these jobs?
3: What kind of things should I know to prepare for this career change?
4: How hard would it be for a guy with limited knowledge to learn this stuff?

 

[chezuki]

Tagged. I was just talking about this exact topic last night.

Ok, I'm having a early-ish life crises... I'm seriously considering going back to school at 33.

I gotta do something. I'm barely scraping by in a dead end job, and my only marketable skills and experience are in a field I have no desire to go back to.

I.T. It's something I've always been into, and I even 'started' going to school for it way back. (I was too busy chasing booze and women to worry a out my future at the time)

 

[GunSlinger]

I'm thinking about taking classes at Ivy Tech so that I can change careers because I'm sick of being a janitor and the shift sucks.I've always liked computers but I don't know much about them.I see jobs all the time for IT guys so it seems like this would be the job market to get into.Can anyone here that does this type of work offer some answers to these questions?

1: What kind of things can I do working on computers that pays well (at least $12+/hr)?
2: What types of classes should I take for these jobs?
3: What kind of things should I know to prepare for this career change?
4: How hard would it be for a guy with limited knowledge to learn this stuff?

1. I can't think of any career in IT that wouldn't pay you at least that much. Even the most basic help desk job will likely pay more than that.
2. It depends on which area of IT you wish to get into. An A+ certification would be a good place to start.
3. Which area of IT do you wish to have a career in? Generalizing there's hardware, software, networking, security, design, engineering, etc.
4. I've personally never found it difficult at all to learn, but then again I'm a true geek. I love this stuff with a passion. If you're doing it only for the money you may find it a bit abstract, but really, it's not difficult at all.

Go after it, you may find out just how much you enjoy it! One bit of advise I will give you is to check with a career counselor at say IvyTech or I.U./P.U. to see what may appeal to you.

 

[wtburnette]

I'm thinking about taking classes at Ivy Tech so that I can change careers because I'm sick of being a janitor and the shift sucks.I've always liked computers but I don't know much about them.I see jobs all the time for IT guys so it seems like this would be the job market to get into.Can anyone here that does this type of work offer some answers to these questions?

1: What kind of things can I do working on computers that pays well (at least $12+/hr)?
2: What types of classes should I take for these jobs?
3: What kind of things should I know to prepare for this career change?
4: How hard would it be for a guy with limited knowledge to learn this stuff?

1. Too many things to list. Programming, network admin, helpdesk, database admin, Information Security, etc. There is a TON to do in IT and the starting wage is generally somewhere around $25k/yr and can go up pretty quickly as long as you keep learning, keep getting certifications and don't stay in one position too long. That doesn't mean change companies, but always look to move up to something with more responsibility.

2. Ivy Tech has good courses, or at least they did back when I went from 93-96. As someone else had mentioned, talk with a career counselor at Ivy Tech to see if they can point you in the right direction. Once you start back to school, don't plan to stop for a while. I stopped after getting my AAS from Ivy Tech, but could have been much further along in my career had I continued on to get my bachelor's degree. I'm now 47 and attending online classes at WGU to rectify my educational shortcomings. I may continue and get my Master's after that, to help me get even further in my career.

3. Nothing really, school should teach you everything you need. I think most schools now have classes that prepare you for certifications like the A+, some of the MS certs, etc. What do you think you'll like to do? Do you like troubleshooting issues and working with people? If so you might like a support role. If you like sitting in your cube and working on writing code, you might enjoy development, or database administration. Personally, I started by having a buddy show me how to take apart and rebuild my personal computer and I went from there. With that knowledge and having started taking classes, the Job Placement department at Ivy Tech helped me to get a job in IT and I kept going, based on what I thought was best from there. I spent 20 years in various support roles before I decided to switch over to InfoSec. I work in vulnerability management for a large company now and love it.

4. It's not hard. I started taking classes and found I had an aptitude for it and have loved it ever since. In over 20 years I've never gotten tired of working in this field, though I've switched to a different side of the field. That's one of the great things about it, there are so many different aspects of IT that there are plenty of different jobs / specialties to choose from. If you don't like it, there are other career fields to go into, someone at Ivy Tech should be able to help point you in the right direction based on what you like. Good luck!

 

[dmarsh8]

I'm kind of in the same boat. I make more and probably better benefits than I would be starting out in the fields i'm interested in such as physical therapy, or possibly IT., but I hate it because it's so boring and we rotate shifts. However, it sounds like they are going to give us the opportunity to change that, so if/when we go to dedicated shifts, that make it much easier to go to school. Life's too short to not do what you love.

 

[perry]

The CompTIA A+ certification is about as basic as it gets for IT support type certifications. You could probably land a help desk job paying more than $12/hr with that certification, so classes that lead you down that path would be worth looking in to. "IT" sounds simple, but there is a LOT of stuff covered in the IT realm. Databases, networking, websites... Do you have a specific area of computers that is more interesting than another?

You know how they say if you enjoy your job then you'll never work a day in your life? It holds true in IT. Make sure you really enjoy working with computers before you head to school.

 

[Scutter01]

3. Nothing really, school should teach you everything you need. I think most schools now have classes that prepare you for certifications like the A+, some of the MS certs, etc.

I absolutely disagree with this statement. I.T. has really become the "mail room" of the 21st Century, where any unskilled person is thrown when the company has no where else to put them. "Just train 'em up!", they tell us, as though the job isn't highly skilled and highly technical. While it's true that schooling is a big part of it, the world of I.T. is as much a hobby or even an artform in that you have to have the passion to do it on your own time and for your own enjoyment, even when you're not being paid. You can teach someone how something works, but you can't teach the kinds of critical thinking skills that a person needs to troubleshoot a complex technical problem.

Let me give you a real-world example. I worked with a guy a few years ago that had the desire and the skill but not the ability. He'd been in the field for years, too. Every time he ran a field service call, his very first action upon arriving at the customer site was to call another engineer and ask him what he should do next. Even though he knew how the software worked and how to use it, he had no idea how to troubleshoot problems with it. If the problem didn't fit one of his pre-defined scripts, he was completely lost. We would have to stop what we were working on so that we could walk him through the problem over the phone, and at that point we might just as well have gone ourselves to fix it.

Furthermore, the field changes so freaking fast that any schooling you take will likely be obsolete within a few years. They can really only teach you core concepts, but not the applications and platforms you're going to deal with day-to-day. If you're not working on it even when you're "off the job", then it's not the field for you, in spite of what the daytime TV commercials want you to believe. I've been in I.T for 22 years. Last week, I sat through 14 hours of training videos that I paid for myself (pluralsight.com - highly recommend) and did it on my own time. That's a fairly typical week for me.

Look at it this way, if you're an auto mechanic, you're not putting the wrench down at 5PM and leaving it until the next morning. Probably, when you get home, you're going to fix some annoying problem on your own car or you're going to spend the weekend tinkering because it's what you love to do. I.T. is the same. We do it because we're driven to do it, not because it's 8AM and time to go to work.

The CompTIA A+ certification is about as basic as it gets for IT support type certifications. You could probably land a help desk job paying more than $12/hr with that certification, so classes that lead you down that path would be worth looking in to. "IT" sounds simple, but there is a LOT of stuff covered in the IT realm. Databases, networking, websites... Do you have a specific area of computers that is more interesting than another?

The A+ is equivalent to 6 months in the field. Other than for entry-level help desk, I don't know anyone that even considers it a useful certification, but it's as good a place to start as anywhere.

You know how they say if you enjoy your job then you'll never work a day in your life? It holds true in IT. Make sure you really enjoy working with computers before you head to school.

100% agree.

 

[Snapdragon]

I think this is a great idea. You're posting on an internet forum, so you have some idea of how to use a computer. It's more difficult to start if you're the type who is afraid to turn one on.

I'm not in your geographical area, but I am very familiar with the Ivy Tech system and curriculum. This page has a lot of information about what programs are offered at what campuses. https://wwwapps.ivytech.edu/cgi-bin/curr/gpprogram_list.cgi (I just checked it and realized that the new CIS and CIT curricula are not loaded yet. They have either just been approved or will be approved within the next week.) If you have any general questions about Ivy Tech that you can't get answered, let me know and I'll see what I can do.

 

[hoosierdoc]

Adults can do a 529 and also deduct non-529 college expenses, right? IT stuff can largely be self taught. Start dabbling with free online stuff and see how you do.

 

[Voldemort]

This is a great question. Back in the day any IT cert. was a ticket to easy money, not so now thanks to our - ah -economy....
I entered a field that demanded certifications and fast, when I didnt know a patch cable from a hole in the ground. It was tough but if you are driven, it is doable. I started with COMPTIA NET+, its the foundation. Then I had to get my CISCO CCNA, that was tough. I recommend self study if possible. Get the most currant book for NET+ off of amazon and read cover to cover. Then go to CCNA, CCENT/ICND1, ICND2, CCDA, CCNP - Exam Information, Practice Tests and Router Simulations and hammer practice exams. The exams are tough, timed and expensive and you cant afford to go into one of these blind. Nowdays employers are looking for experience too, cant help with that. Keep your nose to the grindstone!

 

[ArcadiaGP]

IT is mostly about certifications. I did Ivy Tech as well, mostly online courses. Every IT job I've had has asked more about my experience and certs.

The real money is in specialization, or contracting if you can afford the downtime/insurance. If you know one thing really well... like VMWare, Cisco router config, CRM implimentation, Exchange 10/13 upgrade process, etc...

Some companies would rather hire out for certain things, and they pay a metric ****ton. I haven't done that yet, I'm still just a systems admin... but maybe one day I'll just get really good at one thing and bankroll it.

Get with a company that'll pay for your cert classes/tests.

 

[Scutter01]

This is a great question. Back in the day any IT cert. was a ticket to easy money, not so now thanks to our - ah -economy....
I entered a field that demanded certifications and fast, when I didnt know a patch cable from a hole in the ground. It was tough but if you are driven, it is doable. I started with COMPTIA NET+, its the foundation. Then I had to get my CISCO CCNA, that was tough. I recommend self study if possible. Get the most currant book for NET+ off of amazon and read cover to cover. Then go to CCNA, CCENT/ICND1, ICND2, CCDA, CCNP - Exam Information, Practice Tests and Router Simulations and hammer practice exams. The exams are tough, timed and expensive and you cant afford to go into one of these blind. Nowdays employers are looking for experience too, cant help with that. Keep your nose to the grindstone!

CCNA is a great foundation for pretty much any IT-related field. However, if you're going into programming, database maintenance, or other software-related fields, I'd stop at CCNA. The higher-level Cisco certs aren't much use for those. If you're going for networking, look at CCNA for sure, but Juniper people are in high demand right now and it's hard to find qualified Juniper folks. Virtualization is gigantic right now and only getting bigger. Software-defined networking is going to explode in the next few years, so that's a great place to be in on the ground floor.

As for experience versus certifications, certs aren't valued like they were a decade ago. Certs (and even college degrees) really only get you through the HR department. The tech guys that will be hiring you just want to know how much you know and how much experience you have. They don't really care what letters you have after your name.

 

[iChokePeople]

CCNA is a great foundation for pretty much any IT-related field. However, if you're going into programming, database maintenance, or other software-related fields, I'd stop at CCNA. The higher-level Cisco certs aren't much use for those. If you're going for networking, look at CCNA for sure, but Juniper people are in high demand right now and it's hard to find qualified Juniper folks. Virtualization is gigantic right now and only getting bigger. Software-defined networking is going to explode in the next few years, so that's a great place to be in on the ground floor.

As for experience versus certifications, certs aren't valued like they were a decade ago. Certs (and even college degrees) really only get you through the HR department. The tech guys that will be hiring you just want to know how much you know and how much experience you have. They don't really care what letters you have after your name.

+1. I'll only add one thing about higher level Cisco certs -- if you want a higher end NETWORKING job, they're still pretty solid. CCIE is still a pretty good set of letters to have on your resume.

 

[Kev]

I've been working in the computer field for 12 years now. Grad of Purdue in the IT field. The first thing I recommend is hard to teach... logical thinking. All programming and development really drives down to thinking logically. Start with building this ability and you'll have a good start.

I also see a need for those that can translate business and technical designs/requirements. I may not know all of the different lanuages with computers, but I can sit with a Mgmt/BA/customer type and get their details. Then I can change that into technical specs for a back-end programmer. This requires some people-skills and great communication, but still related to the IT world.

I just wanted to give some different takes on workin in IT, even if you don't have a vast background in hardware/software technology.

 

[Scutter01]

+1. I'll only add one thing about higher level Cisco certs -- if you want a higher end NETWORKING job, they're still pretty solid. CCIE is still a pretty good set of letters to have on your resume.

Oh, yeah. For sure. No one ever went wrong learning Cisco. Did you see that Cisco just changed the CCIE testing program last week? Not sure if it's officially announced yet. They're limiting the number of re-takes per year to 4 and increased the wait time to 30 days, plus some other stuff. That is one heck of a hard exam, too.

 

[HoughMade]

OP, I'll let the computer guys here handle your question...I don't know much about careers in that realm.

However, I'd like to applaud you for starting to take steps to put yourself in a better position. That's what building a career is all about, wanting something better, then working hard to make it happen.

 

[Fletch]

If you've got a computer and the will to learn, you can learn to program without school. The amount of free online help available these days is incredible. I say this as a 20-year career programmer who's completely self-taught. If you want it bad enough you can get into it without formal schooling. If I were getting into it right now, I'd be learning JavaScript and HTML5, particularly using either Backbone or Angular. Companies are snapping up people who display even the slightest bit of ability and training them for whatever else they need.

 

[indyblue]

I have enjoyed my 15+ years of being a Linux Administrator. I taught myself from the days of DOS to Solaris all the way up to Linux. Every Linux position I have had in the last 10 years has paid me $50-90k.

There are lots of free self-study resources to become Linux certified (Linux Professional Institute Certification LPIC-1, 2 & 3) and took the tests own time & expense. LPIC test are only ~$150 each, you must pass two tests for each cert level.

Open Source has enabled a good standard of living for someone like myself who never managed to finish a degree and I've had no trouble finding work in this area. There seems to be a shortage of candidates knowledgeable in Linux so the competition for those positions is less than Windows admin due to the abundance of paper-certified MCSE's out there. It also seems that lately the high cost of MS licensing, many more companies are leaving Windows in the datacenter and moving more to Linux.

Our company production runs 100% free/open source (Ubuntu server) just fine for 15 years now (desktops are still Windows 7 though).

Good luck in your endeavor.

 

[nsolimini]

I agree with a lot of these guys and say certs are a good thing to get, however make sure you actually study and get the cert the correct way. There are a lot of "brain dumps" which are basically the exams posted on the internet and you just memorize them and you can pass the exams to get the cert. When I interview people and I see they have a cert, I will actually ask them questions related to said area that the cert is for to kind of get a feel if they "cheated" to get the cert.

My advice would be to start out at some sort of help desk type job. My first IT job was help desk and I was paid $10 an hour. The knowledge/skills obtained while working the help desk for sure helped me grow to where I am today. I will recommend going into the Information Security side of the house. I enjoy working Information security and you get to do and learn about a lot of cool things. With every hacking, new vulnerability there is I see it as job security for me.

 

[Voldemort]

I agree with a lot of these guys and say certs are a good thing to get, however make sure you actually study and get the cert the correct way. There are a lot of "brain dumps" which are basically the exams posted on the internet and you just memorize them and you can pass the exams to get the cert. When I interview people and I see they have a cert, I will actually ask them questions related to said area that the cert is for to kind of get a feel if they "cheated" to get the cert.

My advice would be to start out at some sort of help desk type job. My first IT job was help desk and I was paid $10 an hour. The knowledge/skills obtained while working the help desk for sure helped me grow to where I am today. I will recommend going into the Information Security side of the house. I enjoy working Information security and you get to do and learn about a lot of cool things. With every hacking, new vulnerability there is I see it as job security for me.

I would tend to disagree here, with the cost of a test being $200.00 on up, the fact that it is timed and the way Cisco words some of their questions, I find it a perfectly legitimate way to prep for an exam using simulated exams. There is a snowballs chance in Hell to pass these things after hitting the books only, the sim questions can make or break you alone. Not to mention that I learned more by doing the sim exams and finding out why I was wrong, than just reading cisco press books. My .02

One thing though, if you dont use it you loose it quick. I went to a security class with Global Knowledge, havent used it since and cant remember a thing....