No knock warrants - do they scare you?

[Colt556]

I also said the police was breaking in like that in the middle of the night, it would probably be because you're a drug dealer or a child molester. Someone who DESERVES to be, well, you know.

I never said if I was a cop, I would actually do that.

Your post had no purple text. Police make mistakes, there have been several cases recently where they went to the wrong address and the results turned out tragic. Even if a person is a scumbag it's not the Police Officer's job to punish them. They have courts to determine guilt and punishment.

 

[PatriotPride]

Tell that to Corey Maye.

That is unbelievable! Tell me he's appealing!

 

[jsharmon7]

We have never experienced any problems with pets. Soon as the flash bang goes off .... they bug out and hide. I've even seen cats climb a walls. As far as getting the wrong address ... no excuses! A lot goes into a raid plan before you hit a home. We usually maintain constant surveillance on the house and verify the target is there or we have a VERY credible source. As far as grabbing the AK with a 75 rnd drum.... it will all be over with before the thought even came to mind.

I know a lot of people keep their guns handy in case of a forced entry by criminals, but I don't think too many people are going to be prepared for an entry by a SWAT team. With all the LEO and Military types we've got on here, I'm surprised more hasn't been said similar to above. There is a reason they make an entry the way they do, it's so people don't have time to react and shoot the cops/soldiers. I know, I know, 95% of INGO'ers are tacticool ninjas trained in jungle assault tactics and could take half the entry team out before the flashbang hit the floor, but for the rest of us mortals I don't think there will be enough time to react to even worry about a shootout.

 

[lovemachine]

]Your post had no purple text[/b]. Police make mistakes, there have been several cases recently where they went to the wrong address and the results turned out tragic. Even if a person is a scumbag it's not the Police Officer's job to punish them. They have courts to determine guilt and punishment.

That was a joke. I figured purple text wouldn't have been needed.

I just said the person would probably be a bad guy that deserves that. I never said that the police SHOULD punish the bad guys. I know it's the job of the courts. And I agree with that. And I never said if I WAS a cop, I would punish anyone.

 

[mrjarrell]

That is unbelievable! Tell me he's appealing!

Still appealing, but at least he's not on death row anymore. For what that's worth.

 

[hickuleas]

No knock warrants

This is just another instance of our (the citizens rights taken away). I will act in the way i have been trained. If someone comes to serve a No knock warrant at my house it won't be a surprise due to my preplanning. This type of action will clearly get people hurt. Good luck serving those warrants.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

This is just another instance of our (the citizens rights taken away). I will act in the way i have been trained. If someone comes to serve a No knock warrant at my house it won't be a surprise due to my preplanning. This type of action will clearly get people hurt. Good luck serving those warrants.

I think you need to borrow my wallet. It says "Bad Mother****er" on it.

 

[downzero]

They have no liability, as has been shown in numerous instances. The verdict is always the same, "the officers acted in accordance with our policies", "nothing to see here". If you're lucky the city will repair your door, but you're responsible for other damages and if they kill a member of your family...that's just too bad.

Yep.

Cory Maye - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Case of Cory Maye - Reason Magazine

You might find yourself on death row....even if the cops are not trained tactical officers. Even if you're not doing anything else wrong. Don't believe me? Read about Cory Maye.

 

[E5RANGER375]

I know a lot of people keep their guns handy in case of a forced entry by criminals, but I don't think too many people are going to be prepared for an entry by a SWAT team. With all the LEO and Military types we've got on here, I'm surprised more hasn't been said similar to above. There is a reason they make an entry the way they do, it's so people don't have time to react and shoot the cops/soldiers. I know, I know, 95% of INGO'ers are tacticool ninjas trained in jungle assault tactics and could take half the entry team out before the flashbang hit the floor, but for the rest of us mortals I don't think there will be enough time to react to even worry about a shootout.

let me tell you about the type "entry" they make. its not safe at all for the team, thats why they use shields (sometimes) and have armor out the ass. unless you are training everyday, you WILL NOT shoot the bad guy on entry before he shoots you!!! even if you do train every day your probly gonna take one depending on where the bad guy is placed when the first member enters. the person in the house has the advantage, even if they are a noob with a gun. now you add TRUE skill to the person in the house and you end up with dead or wounded entry team members.

also about flashbangs ,,,,, its easy to build a level of tollerance to them. they arent a 100% solution or police would just throw flashbangs and walk in without armor on.

 

[mrjarrell]

Yep.

Cory Maye - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Case of Cory Maye - Reason Magazine

You might find yourself on death row....even if the cops are not trained tactical officers. Even if you're not doing anything else wrong. Don't believe me? Read about Cory Maye.

Already mentioned above.

 

[hickuleas]

Hey Frankie, Why don't you serve a warrant at my house and i will give your wallet to your mom.

 

[PatriotPride]

You know, Ranger got me thinking when he asked how the hell you are supposed to respond to police if you've been flashbanged. I know, I know, everyone knows what a flashbang is. I thought that a description of the flashbang (as I was taught) and it's effects might help you to understand how you would react after being flashed.

A M84 stun grenade produces not only a blinding flash which is roughly 65,000 times brighter than a 100 W incandescent lightbulb, but also a deafening blast. The blasts' sound pressure is almost twice as high as the one produced by a jet engine (IIRC).
The flash of light momentarily activates all photosensitive cells in the retina, making vision impossible for approximately five seconds until the eye restores the retina to its original, unstimulated state. Subjects affected by flashbangs describe seeing a single frame for five seconds until it fades and normal sight returns. This is because the sensory cells which have been activated continue sending the same information to the brain until they are restored to their resting state, and the brain translates this continuous information into the same image.
The incredibly loud blast contributes to its incapacitating properties by disturbing the fluid in the semicircular canals of the ear.
There is very little a flashed subject can do to avoid these effects. Keeping your eyes shut and covering your ears is probably far from sufficient. Just something to keep in mind

 

[XMil]

Tell that to Corey Maye.

Hmmmmmmm.... that sounds an awful lot like what I said might happen in my previous post.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Hey Frankie, Why don't you serve a warrant at my house and i will give your wallet to your mom.

Sir,

While this is obviously a highly emotionally charged topic for most of us, this is not called for, nor is it the caliber of discussion we'd prefer to have here.

 

[E5RANGER375]

You know, Ranger got me thinking when he asked how the hell you are supposed to respond to police if you've been flashbanged. I know, I know, everyone knows what a flashbang is. I thought that a description of the flashbang (as I was taught) and it's effects might help you to understand how you would react after being flashed.

A M84 stun grenade produces not only a blinding flash which is roughly 65,000 times brighter than a 100 W incandescent lightbulb, but also a deafening blast. The blasts' sound pressure is almost twice as high as the one produced by a jet engine (IIRC).
The flash of light momentarily activates all photosensitive cells in the retina, making vision impossible for approximately five seconds until the eye restores the retina to its original, unstimulated state. Subjects affected by flashbangs describe seeing a single frame for five seconds until it fades and normal sight returns. This is because the sensory cells which have been activated continue sending the same information to the brain until they are restored to their resting state, and the brain translates this continuous information into the same image.
The incredibly loud blast contributes to its incapacitating properties by disturbing the fluid in the semicircular canals of the ear.
There is very little a flashed subject can do to avoid these effects. Keeping your eyes shut and covering your ears is probably far from sufficient. Just something to keep in mind

open your mouth, maybe it will keep your ear drums from rupturing. i guess the todlers are screwed. and maybe shot too.

 

[littletommy]

If you identify your target before you point a gun at it (like you always should) would you still point a gun at an LEO once you identified them as such?

Yes.

 

[Wabatuckian]

A north Minneapolis family was upstairs in their home early Sunday when they heard someone bust through their back door.

Vang Khang's family said Vang grabbed his hunting gun to protect himself, his wife, and his six children.

"He thought they were gang members and he was scared," Vang's brother, Dao Khang said.

Dao Khang said Vang fired a warning shot, and then two more shots through his bedroom door, which was closed.

Vang was trying to scare the intruders away, his family said. Vang didn't know that they were members of the Minneapolis Police Department's SWAT team, which was executing a search warrant inside his home in the 1300 block of Logan Avenue North.

Vang hit two of the officers. Neither was injured. Both were wearing bullet proof vests and helmets.

The officers returned fire and have been placed on administrative leave, which police say is standard procedure.

Vang was arrested and released hours later.

Police say they executed a few search warrants over the weekend based on some information they received as part of a long-term investigation. Police confiscated weapons at some of the other homes. But after entering Khang's home, investigators learned it was not part of the investigation.

"It was some bad information that was received on the front end that kind-of trickled all the way through," Sgt. Jess Garcia said. "It's unfortunate because we have officers that were hit by gunfire and this truly, truly could have been a much worse situation."

Vang's family said he and his children, who range in age from three to fifteen, are still shaken.

"All these gunshots in the house. They don't know what's going on. Flying bullets in the house and they just cried," Dao Khang said.

Police say they are investigating whether to charge Vang Khang for shooting the officers.

"Bad information" caused police to raid wrong house | Minneapolis and St. Paul | kare11.com

Bad guys wear vests too, and I therefore keep a loaded rifle in a real rifle caliber for home defense.

I hope nobody ever makes a mistake of targeting me. Most of the police officers around here are either friends or friendly acquaintances, and so I'd hope the situation would be modified before it became a real problem.

I have no wish to kill anyone, good guys least of all - and I recognize that many of those good guys are only doing the no-knock thing because they were ordered to do so.

Josh

 

[zebov]

This is getting a little too heated here. I mean seriously, death threats?

I was really hoping for some insight into how one could prevent a Cory Maye incident. I like to think that what some have said are true... that if it really is the Law coming, I'm not going to be able to react quickly enough to get myself or anyone else in any trouble. And I gotta say, if flashbangs were coming through my windows I would likely second-guess whether it was home intruders coming in (don't know too many stories of that type of event with run-of-the-mill criminals).

What I'm not comfortable with is if the officers DON'T immediately overwhelm me--if instead they come in yelling and screaming with bright lights in my eyes and masks on their faces... almost exactly what I'd expect from a criminal trying to gain control of a house.

I guess I should just pray any police officers on such a Dynamic Entry team are REALLY good at their job and can come in and either subdue me or make it apparent they are LEOs before I can defend myself.

 

[mrjarrell]

You know, Ranger got me thinking when he asked how the hell you are supposed to respond to police if you've been flashbanged. I know, I know, everyone knows what a flashbang is. I thought that a description of the flashbang (as I was taught) and it's effects might help you to understand how you would react after being flashed.

A M84 stun grenade produces not only a blinding flash which is roughly 65,000 times brighter than a 100 W incandescent lightbulb, but also a deafening blast. The blasts' sound pressure is almost twice as high as the one produced by a jet engine (IIRC).
The flash of light momentarily activates all photosensitive cells in the retina, making vision impossible for approximately five seconds until the eye restores the retina to its original, unstimulated state. Subjects affected by flashbangs describe seeing a single frame for five seconds until it fades and normal sight returns. This is because the sensory cells which have been activated continue sending the same information to the brain until they are restored to their resting state, and the brain translates this continuous information into the same image.
The incredibly loud blast contributes to its incapacitating properties by disturbing the fluid in the semicircular canals of the ear.
There is very little a flashed subject can do to avoid these effects. Keeping your eyes shut and covering your ears is probably far from sufficient. Just something to keep in mind

Also be aware that if it hits furniture, like a bed or couch, there's a serious risk of it starting a fire. Enforcers in a number of locales have burned peoples homes down with them.

 

[littletommy]

It just kind of sickens me a little that cops, or anyone, for that matter, would make excuses for this sort of thing. Invading a persons home is about as low as it gets, and I don't care who is doing the invading. I make mistakes, you make mistakes, everybody makes mistakes, but there is no making mistakes when you and your buddies are getting ready to kick in a door. Period. EVER! I am not involved in criminal activity of any kind, but if my door were to be breached in the middle of the night, there will be loss of life, wether it be me, or 10 cops, or 10 thugs, there will be loss of life.