'No gun' notifications

[Zero_G]

I lived in Indiana for the first 35 years of my life, but I didn't carry back in those days. I still come back frequently to visit friends and family so I want to make sure I understand the laws here. I currently reside in Texas (courtesy of the USAF), and the laws there are very specific as to the type of sign required to restrict concealed carry. I understand Indiana does not have such specific requirements.

Today I was in Lafayette Square Mall in Indy where my car had broken down. This is not the best area of town and the mall has been the site of recent gang activity, so carrying would definitely be a good thing, IMNSHO. I noticed a poster inside the entrance entitled "Lafayette Square Mall Code of Conduct", and mainly due to boredom actually started to read it. The poster was approx 18x24 and had fairly fine print (maybe 1/4" lettering). Down about 4th or 5th was wording to the effect of "No licensed or unlicensed carry of concealed weapons (police exempted)".

I consider signs of this nature to be very much like the "by clicking here you agree to..." on software packages - essentially invisible and meaningless. In Texas, this would be no bar to entry for the holder of a concealed carry permit. How about Indiana? It seems like for notice to be effective, it would have to be displayed prominently. There was no other indication of gun restrictions (such as a 'gunbuster' sign, something that gets laughed about in Texas).

Keith

 

[Bapak2ja]

Great question! I will be watching closely for the reply.

 

[shibumiseeker]

You are good to go carrying there, sign or no sign. However, if they ask you to leave and you refuse then you may be charged with criminal trespass.

 

[sporter]

It's just a policy of the Mall. It does not carry the weight of law behind it.
The only they can do is ask you to leave, if you don't then you might will run into some issues.

 

[Eddie]

The employer's remedy would be under the state's tresspassing statute. They could sue civilly or try to have you arrested. You would have a defense that you didn't see the sign. The problem for you would be that while you would have a good defense, you might spend $10,000 asserting that defense in court. On the other hand if they noticed you carrying they might just ask you to leave.

 

[bobn911]

"No licensed or unlicensed carry of concealed weapons (police exempted)".

Keith

Looks like to me, you should be able to Open Carry with no problems.
Later, Bob

 

[DoubleTap Tactical]

Mall policy and they can tresspass you.

 

[AFA1CY]

I CC and OC in the mall all the time.... The Internet mall that is. Seem to do more shopping via mouse than going to the B&M (brick and mortar) mall stores.

 

[Mr. Habib]

The sign carries no weight of law and means nothing. As the property owners / managers they can ask you to leave for any reason, or no reason at all. If you refuse they can have you arrested for trespass. The thing I find funny about these signs at the malls is that they are only posted at mall entrances, not entrances to stores. you could enter the mall through a major store and never be near one of those signs.

 

[AuntieBellum]

The sign carries no weight of law and means nothing. As the property owners / managers they can ask you to leave for any reason, or no reason at all. If you refuse they can have you arrested for trespass. The thing I find funny about these signs at the malls is that they are only posted at mall entrances, not entrances to stores. you could enter the mall through a major store and never be near one of those signs.

Signs? What signs? JCPenney, Sears, Macys, and Carson Pirie Scott do not have any such signs.

 

[HICKMAN]

Looks like to me, you should be able to Open Carry with no problems.
Later, Bob

Heh, I was thinking the same thing.

 

[BloodEclipse]

The employer's remedy would be under the state's tresspassing statute. They could sue civilly or try to have you arrested. You would have a defense that you didn't see the sign. The problem for you would be that while you would have a good defense, you might spend $10,000 asserting that defense in court. On the other hand if they noticed you carrying they might just ask you to leave.

It doesn't matter if you saw the sign or not. If you violate "Mall Policy" they can ask you to leave and nothing more. You have violated no law by simply entering. If you refuse to leave then you can be charged.

 

[irishfan]

If I am not mistaken then all Simon Properties malls are no carry except for police. I have in the Muncie mall many times and will continue to do so until they ask me to leave.

 

[Militarypol21]

As far as the mall area itself, it's mall policy NOT LAW. But say for instance you came in through the Mall Entrance en route to Sears (when it use to be in business) to do some shopping. Mall Security stops you outside the Sears Entrance and tells you to leave. As soon as you step into Sears you are no longer on mall property and can continue your shopping since Sears owned their own building and since Sears doesn't have no gun policy. But, you will not be able to walk back into the mall carrying your gun after leaving Sears since they told you to leave already. I'm pretty sure Macy's has a rental agreement with the mall so I'm not 100% on which rules you would have to abide by there.

 

[jsgolfman]

I think you'd be hard pressed to find any property management company, like Simon's, that would allow their tenants to establish policies that run contrary to the property owners. My guess is it would be stipulated in the contract that the tenant must abide by all existing and future property policy.

 

[Zero_G]

So then, to help me understand the Indiana laws better, is there any signage that a property owner can post to legally restrict concealed carry on their property? Or is it all just as been discussed above - the signs don't carry any weight of law, but if you are approached and given verbal notice to leave you commit criminal trespass by not leaving?

Inquiring minds want to know!

Keith

 

[bigus_D]

So then, to help me understand the Indiana laws better, is there any signage that a property owner can post to legally restrict concealed carry on their property? Or is it all just as been discussed above - the signs don't carry any weight of law, but if you are approached and given verbal notice to leave you commit criminal trespass by not leaving?

Inquiring minds want to know!

Keith

In Indiana, signage of this sort does not carry the weight of the law.

Of course, there ARE places (government buildings, schools, etc.) where carry is forbidden by law... but at the mall, the sign is basically meaningless.