I did something I said I'd never do again...I bought a Taurus.

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  • 92FSTech

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    Dec 24, 2020
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    I like to hike and backpack quite a bit, and this has driven an interest in lightweight, big-bore revolvers. I have a 329PD, a snubby Model 69, and a 4 5/8 Blackhawk in .45 Colt. Those guns are awesome, but the 69 and the Blackhawk are both pretty heavy, and the 329 is awesome to carry but downright painful to shoot. I've always been a fan of the .45 Colt, and couldn't get this idea out of my head that a lightweight, short-barreled, 5-shot .45 Colt would be the goldilocks woods carry gun.

    53937058538_ba4bd718f5_o.jpg


    Unfortunately, nobody cares about the .45 Colt anymore. Sure the cowboy action crowd likes it, but I've already got a single-action and that's not what I'm looking for. To my knowledge Smith never offered a snubby 325 in .45 Colt, and even the short-barreled steel guns bring upwards of $2k these days. Enter Taurus. Not only did they make one, but from 1999-2002, they made one in Titanium that only weighs 19oz. I've had bad experiences with a couple of Taurus revolvers in the past and swore I would never buy another, but I just couldn't get this one out of my head. I casually watched Gunbroker for a while until a couple of weeks ago one came up for a price that I couldn't refuse.

    53935904692_6b1b91d370_o.jpg


    Mechanically, it's not bad. Fit and finish is on par with my Smiths, the grips are comfortable and well designed, and the trigger is not amazing but acceptable. Lockup and carryup are good even under recoil, and there are no timing issues.

    As a result of trying to squeeze a .45" diameter tube into such a small package, the forcing cone is very thin at the base. Those of you familiar with the cracked forcing cones in .357 K-frames will likely cringe as I did when you see this. This gun will definitely not be digesting any "Ruger-Only" .45 Colt loads.

    53937260870_ec3e590510_o.jpg


    The barrel is ported. This is stupid. It produces blast and muzzle flash right in front of the shooter's face, does little to nothing for the recoil, and likely has a negative impact on ballistics, which are already compromised due to the short barrel. It's also a pain to clean. I wish they hadn't done this.

    53938934515_c6d24c4c72_o.jpg


    The biggest problem by far, though, is accuracy. It's just all over the place. My regular .45 Colt load is a 250gr LRNFP over 8gr of Unique, and it shoots great in my other guns but this thing won't even keep it on paper at 15 yards. It's showing evidence of tumbling, so I'm pretty sure it's not stabilizing the bullets out of that short barrel. I've been playing with some different .45 Colt loads, including some 185gr and 200gr bullets to try and see if I can find something lit likes, but so far they're all pretty bad.

    Interestingly, I tried a powderpuff .45 Schofield load using my home cast 230Gr truncated cone bullets that I use for .45ACP, and that load performed pretty well. Unfortunately, it's only going about 600 FPS, so not exactly useful as a bear defense/woods gun option.

    The targets below are the 250gr load (lots of rounds off the top of the paper), the Schofield load, the 200gr load (1 round off paper), and the 185 gr load (3 rounds off paper) at 15 yards.

    53953555467_3500a643c2_o.jpg


    Here's a second target with 5 more of the Schofield load circled in red (the green was a different load), also at 15 yards, so it's showing some promising consistency.

    53953555462_9cc384beaa_o.jpg


    I'm planning to load up a few more of the 230gr Schofields to give it a more thorough test, and probably some in .45 Colt as well, at different velocities, but I was wondering if anybody here had any experience feeding one of these or handloading for it. At this point I don't think it's ever going to adequately fulfill my original intended purpose, but I'd like to at least find a load that it will shoot.
     

    92FSTech

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    You might have found the reason it was for sale
    Possibly. There's nothing broken or mechanically wrong with it, though, so I think it's just a matter of figuring out a load that's compatible with its engineering. The light Schofield load putting up a passable group has me optimistic in that regard. I loaded up a few more with that same bullet, in both Schofield and Colt cases, to try this weekend.
     

    DadSmith

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    Oct 21, 2018
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    Ripley County
    I like to hike and backpack quite a bit, and this has driven an interest in lightweight, big-bore revolvers. I have a 329PD, a snubby Model 69, and a 4 5/8 Blackhawk in .45 Colt. Those guns are awesome, but the 69 and the Blackhawk are both pretty heavy, and the 329 is awesome to carry but downright painful to shoot. I've always been a fan of the .45 Colt, and couldn't get this idea out of my head that a lightweight, short-barreled, 5-shot .45 Colt would be the goldilocks woods carry gun.

    53937058538_ba4bd718f5_o.jpg


    Unfortunately, nobody cares about the .45 Colt anymore. Sure the cowboy action crowd likes it, but I've already got a single-action and that's not what I'm looking for. To my knowledge Smith never offered a snubby 325 in .45 Colt, and even the short-barreled steel guns bring upwards of $2k these days. Enter Taurus. Not only did they make one, but from 1999-2002, they made one in Titanium that only weighs 19oz. I've had bad experiences with a couple of Taurus revolvers in the past and swore I would never buy another, but I just couldn't get this one out of my head. I casually watched Gunbroker for a while until a couple of weeks ago one came up for a price that I couldn't refuse.

    53935904692_6b1b91d370_o.jpg


    Mechanically, it's not bad. Fit and finish is on par with my Smiths, the grips are comfortable and well designed, and the trigger is not amazing but acceptable. Lockup and carryup are good even under recoil, and there are no timing issues.

    As a result of trying to squeeze a .45" diameter tube into such a small package, the forcing cone is very thin at the base. Those of you familiar with the cracked forcing cones in .357 K-frames will likely cringe as I did when you see this. This gun will definitely not be digesting any "Ruger-Only" .45 Colt loads.

    53937260870_ec3e590510_o.jpg


    The barrel is ported. This is stupid. It produces blast and muzzle flash right in front of the shooter's face, does little to nothing for the recoil, and likely has a negative impact on ballistics, which are already compromised due to the short barrel. It's also a pain to clean. I wish they hadn't done this.

    53938934515_c6d24c4c72_o.jpg


    The biggest problem by far, though, is accuracy. It's just all over the place. My regular .45 Colt load is a 250gr LRNFP over 8gr of Unique, and it shoots great in my other guns but this thing won't even keep it on paper at 15 yards. It's showing evidence of tumbling, so I'm pretty sure it's not stabilizing the bullets out of that short barrel. I've been playing with some different .45 Colt loads, including some 185gr and 200gr bullets to try and see if I can find something lit likes, but so far they're all pretty bad.

    Interestingly, I tried a powderpuff .45 Schofield load using my home cast 230Gr truncated cone bullets that I use for .45ACP, and that load performed pretty well. Unfortunately, it's only going about 600 FPS, so not exactly useful as a bear defense/woods gun option.

    The targets below are the 250gr load (lots of rounds off the top of the paper), the Schofield load, the 200gr load (1 round off paper), and the 185 gr load (3 rounds off paper) at 15 yards.

    53953555467_3500a643c2_o.jpg


    Here's a second target with 5 more of the Schofield load circled in red (the green was a different load), also at 15 yards, so it's showing some promising consistency.

    53953555462_9cc384beaa_o.jpg


    I'm planning to load up a few more of the 230gr Schofields to give it a more thorough test, and probably some in .45 Colt as well, at different velocities, but I was wondering if anybody here had any experience feeding one of these or handloading for it. At this point I don't think it's ever going to adequately fulfill my original intended purpose, but I'd like to at least find a load that it will shoot.
    Try 300gr pills at the lower pressure velocity.
    I'm thinking even if it's slow with a 300gr bullet it's still going to get good penetration.
    However, it sounds like it may not like the longer profile bullets since it shot the lighter ones better.
    Another thought try to slug it and see if the bore is bigger than normal. If that I the case it might just need a larger diameter bullet.
    Just tossing ideas out there.
     

    92FSTech

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    North Central
    Try 300gr pills at the lower pressure velocity.
    I'm thinking even if it's slow with a 300gr bullet it's still going to get good penetration.
    However, it sounds like it may not like the longer profile bullets since it shot the lighter ones better.
    Another thought try to slug it and see if the bore is bigger than normal. If that I the case it might just need a larger diameter bullet.
    Just tossing ideas out there.
    I don't have any 300gr bullets, but if I can get consistently acceptable results out of the 230s, I may work back into the 250s at lower pressure and see what happens, and then maybe find some 300s if I can get those to work.

    I had thought about slugging the chambers and the bore, but that is always kind of a pain, and those 230s were cast with the same lead, coated with the same powder, and sized with the same die as the 250s, so if they work it's pretty doubtful that it's a chamber or bore size issue. But that's definitely on the table if I can't get anything else to work.
     
    Last edited:

    92FSTech

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    I shot it again today with the Schofield load, and while it was on paper, it still wasn't great.

    All targets shot at 15 yards, standing, unsupported:

    450:
    IMG_20240831_170536722.jpg

    S&W 642UC
    IMG_20240831_115241898.jpg

    P226
    IMG_20240831_115945685.jpg

    I'm far from a professional bullseye shooter, but when a I'm outshooting a gun with an airweight J-Frame, that's not a good thing. The trigger on the 450 did leave a bit to be desired, so to help eliminate that as a factor I decided to pop the side plate and clean that up.

    IMG_20240831_134234275_HDR.jpg

    Conceptually it's very similar inside to a Smith, but there are some differences. The rebound spring assembly rides on a rod and a stud that fits into a hole in the frame, unlike a Smith with the spring nested inside the rebound slide. I found the Taurus design easier to deal with.

    The thumbpiece on the Taurus is held on by a screw rather than a nut on a stud like a Smith. The transfer bar design is different, as is the way that the hand interfaces with the trigger. The parts seemed to be of decent quality, but some were pretty rough with a lot of machining or forging marks in them.

    The cylinder and arbor interface is completely different, and IMO inferior to a Smith. Instead of simply sliding apart when it's removed from the gun, the Taurus cylinder is clamped onto the arbor with a pressed-in bushing, and as far as I can tell you either need a special tool to remove it, or you're going to have to destroy and replace it. I'm not a fan, particularly because the cylinder doesn't spin as freely as I like, and I can't get in there to sort it out. That's going to have a noticeable impact on the DA pull.

    A few hours with a stone and some sandpaper and the trigger is much better than it was. There were a few areas that were so rough from the factory that I couldn't smooth them out as much as I would have liked without removing too much material, plus the cylinder arbor that I couldn't get to. Ultimately I'd say it's now on par with a middle of the road S&W revolver trigger...not as good as my best one, but better than the worst.
     

    Squid556

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    Fantastic write up @92FSTech

    I’m curious what weight jacketed bullets have been tested. I’m wondering if it don’t like soft bullets.

    Off subject but hanging in my mind…. Today I saw someone advertising a 5 inch barrel 5.56 upper. That was made with a 1-5” twist. Unheard of by me until now. And it made me think that the ultra short barrel required a non standard twist rate to better stabilize 5.56. It makes me wonder if this could apply to you, if perhaps getting a longer and harder bullet would stabilize better
     

    92FSTech

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    Fantastic write up @92FSTech

    I’m curious what weight jacketed bullets have been tested. I’m wondering if it don’t like soft bullets.

    Off subject but hanging in my mind…. Today I saw someone advertising a 5 inch barrel 5.56 upper. That was made with a 1-5” twist. Unheard of by me until now. And it made me think that the ultra short barrel required a non standard twist rate to better stabilize 5.56. It makes me wonder if this could apply to you, if perhaps getting a longer and harder bullet would stabilize better
    We're thinking the same thing at the same time, lol. I just loaded some 230gr XTPs into Schofield cases last night, and am hoping to get to try them today. Those and some 250gr XTPs are the only jacketed bullets I have on hand right now. We'll see what happens.
     

    92FSTech

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    Well, I think we're getting somewhere. Just got back from the range where I shot 10 of the cast 230s and 10 XTPs, both loaded in Schofield cases over 5.5gr of Unique. The cast bullets were about like before, but the XTPs put up what I'd call a decent group at 15 yards...not target pistol accurate but not bad for an airweight snubby.

    IMG_20240901_155658463.jpg

    Now to figure out how to get it to hit to point of aim. If that group was down and to the right about 4 inches, I'd be content. Part of me wonders if the soft rubber grips aren't part of that issue...allowing the gun to rotate in the hand under recoil.

    With these powderpuff loads I definitely don't need the padding, but I'm going to have to see more consistency before I'm willing to invest the money in a new set of grips for this thing. I do have some moon clips coming for it, and if they work I'll try some .45 ACP through it and see how that goes.

    I have to admit that apart from the accuracy issues, this thing has performed like a champ. I've got a couple hundred rounds through it now and the only problem I've had was a single light strike on a primer that was questionable to start with.
     

    92FSTech

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    I found some grips for this thing on Amazon from a Brazilian company called MBT. They are hard plastic, and appear to be 3D printed, but fit well and don't allow the gun to jump in the hand as much as the factory rubbers. I cut them down to about "boot" length, and I'm pretty happy with the result.

    IMG_20240919_195944723_HDR.jpg

    I also scored some 185gr XTPs at the LGS last weekend. It's putting up what I'd call a fair group at this point....nothing to get too excited about, but I have to remind myself that it's a snub-nosed revolver. The groups below are a light load in Schofield Brass and a slightly hotter load in .45 Colt Brass, both shot at 15 yards. Both of these shot low. The 230s were high. So maybe if I split the difference and find some 200s I'll be right where I want to be, lol.

    IMG_20240919_084342100.jpg
    IMG_20240919_084827168.jpg

    The other issue is the shooting left. I had a buddy shoot it and it did that for him as well, so it's not just me. It's not so bad that I can't compensate for it, but I wish I could center that up a bit. I guess I should be happy that I've at least moved past the shotgun pattern targets. I had to shoot my P320 for a bit after I got done with the Taurus today, just to convince myself that it wasn't all me!
     

    DadSmith

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    I found some grips for this thing on Amazon from a Brazilian company called MBT. They are hard plastic, and appear to be 3D printed, but fit well and don't allow the gun to jump in the hand as much as the factory rubbers. I cut them down to about "boot" length, and I'm pretty happy with the result.

    View attachment 381362

    I also scored some 185gr XTPs at the LGS last weekend. It's putting up what I'd call a fair group at this point....nothing to get too excited about, but I have to remind myself that it's a snub-nosed revolver. The groups below are a light load in Schofield Brass and a slightly hotter load in .45 Colt Brass, both shot at 15 yards. Both of these shot low. The 230s were high. So maybe if I split the difference and find some 200s I'll be right where I want to be, lol.

    View attachment 381363
    View attachment 381364

    The other issue is the shooting left. I had a buddy shoot it and it did that for him as well, so it's not just me. It's not so bad that I can't compensate for it, but I wish I could center that up a bit. I guess I should be happy that I've at least moved past the shotgun pattern targets. I had to shoot my P320 for a bit after I got done with the Taurus today, just to convince myself that it wasn't all me!
    Once you find out what it likes you might have a pretty decent snubby.
    I'm enjoying reading about your quest for the right load.
     
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