Gouging gun prices

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  • roisigns

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 92.9%
    13   1   0
    Oct 5, 2011
    498
    18
    cincy
    I read this about the recent price bubble of guns & ammo. I did not write it.


    "GOUGER.

    That is a ugly word. I notice it gets thrown around alot any time there is high demand for a good, or product.

    GOUGER.

    Stop and think about the implication.
    What exactly is a Gouger? Is it someone that makes triple his cost on an investment? Double? Makes any profit at all? Who decides what is "too much" profit? Is it "unfair" just because you have a negative emotional reaction to it?

    In fact, we have a system to determine fair market value for a product. It's called supply and demand.

    As the supply of a good goes up, and the demand decreases, the price goes down.
    As the supply decreases, and demand increases, the price goes up.

    In life there are those that plan ahead, and those that don't. Usually the planners make sacrifices in order to be ready for conditions in the future.

    For example, lets say you scrape and save to buy land at a relatively low price per acre. Even though it's a huge burden and you barely have the money, you do it anyway because you think it could pay off. You tie up your money instead of having it for other things. You risk loss. You take a gamble.

    And lets say I buy xbox games and Cheetos, because that's more fun, and tasty, and its cheaper, and that's how I choose to spend my hard earned money.

    Then in ten years, industry moves into the area. Suddenly everyone wants the land for all kinds of reasons. The demand goes way up, and your land triples in value. Your risk has payed off.

    Now all the sudden I want land. I want the land you have. I wish I would have bought it sooner, but I chose not to. I bought fun xbox and tasty Cheetos. The good news for me is that it's not too late, I can still have it. But I have to pay a premium.

    Would you be a Gouger to charge me the current market value for your land? Would it be "unfair" and "disgusting" to charge more than what was originally paid?

    Or would it in fact be UNFAIR and DISGUSTING OF ME to EXPECT and DEMAND that you, after all your planning, hard work, and sacrifice, simply HAND IT OVER to me for little or absolutely NO GAIN?

    It's really very simple, but those who would favor centralized government control have always hated the idea of a free market. There is also always a fresh supply of the usefully ignorant who go right along with the emotionally natural, intellectually easy "unfair, unfair!" argument.

    It is easy to demonize a person who has planned ahead, but what does it really help?

    The unprepared always end up benefiting from the planners, even if it's for a premium. Frankly I'm never happy to have to pay a "high price", but am grateful I have the opportunity to make that choice.

    It's called the free market. If you don't like it, don't participate. That is your choice. But spare us the tearful pleas for civility and let the grownups do business."
     

    fallenangel1

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 26, 2013
    412
    18
    Gouging is selling something that is used for more than what the MSRP on a new item is. People get scared and fall prey to the ones taking advantage of the scare, when they should just wait it out and in a few months you can have a new item for normal MSRP or less.

    I feel the land scenario is not a good analogy, There is only one plot of land in said spot. So youre selling or buying something that is one of a kind. So the value can only be determined by what the seller is selling it for and if someone will pay that.

    Guns are mass produced and can be had from the dealers for set MSRP like prices. You wait it out and you can usally find whatever you want at or below MSRP and something used, unless it's unique in some way, will decrease in value because it is used. And new versions are typically readily available. people didnt "invest" in 9mm Glocks they bought some and saw people selling at crazy prices and just jumped on the bandwagon. Most of them knew that they could sell high now and wait and get a new Gen4 in a few months for less than they charged for their Gen3 with 1,000+ rounds through the pipe oh and don't forget they only sold it with 1 magazine as well so there's $50/mag extra they can profit too. Or the others that did invest, found someplace that was selling at normal prices and bought everythign that they could then went to gunbroker and listed it for $200-300 more than what they just paid.

    You can preach supply and demand and free market and capitalism .. But everyone knows that people can take advantage of situations. Thats why we have anti-monoploy laws and even back immediately following Sept 11th when all of the oil companies decided to cash in on the tragedy and charge insane prices for gas, just because they could. Thankfully they got their hands slapped and they were fined for gouging. If not we'd all probably be paying $8-10/gal now.
     

    68_F100

    Expert
    Rating - 93.9%
    31   2   0
    Nov 8, 2010
    809
    18
    North Salem
    frabz-Cool-story-bro-52adac.jpg
     

    RabbleRouser

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Dec 24, 2011
    582
    16
    Mishawaka
    gouging only applies if it is a necessity (food,water and other essentials) guns are a luxury item no matter what we think or assume. you always have the option of not buying it.

    as an aside: we all saw this coming for a long time and if you didnt then you are blind or asleep, instead of getting butthurt and whining about people selling things at an inflated price you should be mad at yourself for not buying the items you wanted when the supply was high an the price was low. things will eventually calm down one way or another and prices will stabilize, probably at a price between what it was before the panic and what its at now.
     

    fallenangel1

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 26, 2013
    412
    18
    Nothing is ever black and white .. sometimes things are rare and go up in value .. it is a fact .. But in an instance like this sellers are preying on fear. Right now at this point in time there are no new bans and everything that we could buy last year can be bought now. People got scared that they were going to lose the right to own something so they started buying. Selling something at those prices based on fear to me is gouging. Im sure that most people that paid $700+ for a used 9mm Glock is already kicking themselves or is blissfully ignorant and just happy that they have one.

    Obviously if items were/are banned then there will be no new one hitting the market anytime soon therfore the only way to get one is to buy used. That changes the dynamic and at that point the value starts shifting to actual supply vs demand.
     

    midget

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Apr 2, 2010
    1,619
    38
    Leo
    So, an alternative view of this. How long until people start getting reported to the ATF for operating without an FFL (buying with the sole intention of selling for profit)...
     

    Pinchaser

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Nov 26, 2012
    765
    18
    There is no such thing as gouging. It is a term without definition. You cannot be "gouged." The OP's post is accurate. This thing some call "gouging" is American Capitalism at its best. Thank your God of choice each night that we are still free to participate in such a negotiation.
     

    thumperdogg

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    37   0   0
    Jul 14, 2011
    1,047
    0
    Hartford City
    We all complain about gouging at the pumps on a daily basis, why are guns different?

    An individual gouger -Someone who frequents stores looking for ammo and guns they don't want, but buy them up as soon as they hit the shelf to make a hefty profit on them. (Illegal to do with guns without a FFL, but they do it anyway)

    A storefront gouger - A LGS who doesn't pay anymore for a gun at dealer cost than they did before the market went crazy, but marks the item up 2x or 3x over original cost.

    You can call this supply and demand, free market, or anything you want. I call it GREED. There has been so much support your LGS only to be raped by the same LGS you have been told to support.

    I hope these gouging shops make enough money off of this panic to support them for quite a long time into the future. When the dust settles and prices go back to the norm, these same LGS are going to be destroyed by online retailers with much better pricing.

    Why? When you take advantage of loyal customers like this, they will remember it! I have seen many customers vow to never do business with some of these LGS after the price mark ups we have seen. Why not buy it online for $100 less and not give the money to the greedy LGS that tried to rape you months prior?

    Not all LGS are like this, though I have never been a fan of the high prices of LGS, I can say Bradis seems to have kept their head on straight the most! +1 to them for keeping it real and not busting heads in these times, I am sure they will reap the benefits after the panic fizzles.
     

    fallenangel1

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 26, 2013
    412
    18
    Midget and thumper make good points, people are buying with the sole intention of reselling at a mark up. Which happens to be illegal, but according to some of you others, that's alright. I mean why not sell a Glock 19 that's seen 500+ rounds with only 1 mag for $650. When you could go to Orions and get one for $535 brand new in the box!

    Everyone is saying that people do not have to buy, but in their minds, they do. They were scared that they would not be able to buy these unless they paid the hefty ransom and there are still those people out there that are scared and just don't know of the good LGS's that have these same guns in new condition for over $100 less than someone on here or any other site.
     

    thumperdogg

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    37   0   0
    Jul 14, 2011
    1,047
    0
    Hartford City
    Yes. 90+% of the population are Marxists.

    People agree to overpay quite a bit because they fear if they don't buy it now, they will never have the opportunity to buy it in the future because of a possible ban.

    Similar to a gas station jacking up their prices before a big storm, people pay it because of the fear they will not be able to get it.

    I do not live my life in fear of anything, I refuse to overpay for anything!
     

    hornadylnl

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Nov 19, 2008
    21,505
    63
    People agree to overpay quite a bit because they fear if they don't buy it now, they will never have the opportunity to buy it in the future because of a possible ban.

    Similar to a gas station jacking up their prices before a big storm, people pay it because of the fear they will not be able to get it.

    I do not live my life in fear of anything, I refuse to overpay for anything!

    So do I. But I don't think I'm entitled to the property of others at my price.
     

    hornadylnl

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Nov 19, 2008
    21,505
    63
    Who here is being forced to pay these high prices? I've not had a gun pointed to my head forcing me to buy a damn thing when I've looked at the INGO classifieds, Armslist, Gunbroker, gun shops, etc.

    It's funny how I can go over to the General Political Discussion forum and read all the posts from those railing against socialism, welfare, entitlements, etc but as soon as the gun industry is affected, all the sudden capatilism isn't so grand.

    I could make a fortune off of some of the stuff I have right now but I'll likely never list any guns or ammo on the INGO classifieds again. I'll burn it in a fire before I sell 22 ammo a buck a round to Marxists who think they're entitled to my property on their terms.

    Who is John Galt?
     

    hornadylnl

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Nov 19, 2008
    21,505
    63
    So, an alternative view of this. How long until people start getting reported to the ATF for operating without an FFL (buying with the sole intention of selling for profit)...

    I'm sure there are INGOers more than willing to report violators of unconstitutional law to combat those evil gougers.
     

    redlegrod

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 29, 2010
    146
    16
    North Central Indiana
    Why are some of you so anti free markets? Let me ask you this--next time your boss wants to give you a raise do you take it or not? Does that make you GREEDY or not especially since there are less fortunate than you?
     

    hornadylnl

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Nov 19, 2008
    21,505
    63
    We all complain about gouging at the pumps on a daily basis, why are guns different?

    An individual gouger -Someone who frequents stores looking for ammo and guns they don't want, but buy them up as soon as they hit the shelf to make a hefty profit on them. (Illegal to do with guns without a FFL, but they do it anyway)

    A storefront gouger - A LGS who doesn't pay anymore for a gun at dealer cost than they did before the market went crazy, but marks the item up 2x or 3x over original cost.

    You can call this supply and demand, free market, or anything you want. I call it GREED. There has been so much support your LGS only to be raped by the same LGS you have been told to support.

    I hope these gouging shops make enough money off of this panic to support them for quite a long time into the future. When the dust settles and prices go back to the norm, these same LGS are going to be destroyed by online retailers with much better pricing.

    Why? When you take advantage of loyal customers like this, they will remember it! I have seen many customers vow to never do business with some of these LGS after the price mark ups we have seen. Why not buy it online for $100 less and not give the money to the greedy LGS that tried to rape you months prior?

    Not all LGS are like this, though I have never been a fan of the high prices of LGS, I can say Bradis seems to have kept their head on straight the most! +1 to them for keeping it real and not busting heads in these times, I am sure they will reap the benefits after the panic fizzles.


    What kind of gouger is a stock trader who buys and sells stocks for profit? Is he not a gouger if he buys a stock at $10 and sells if for $12 when it goes up to $20?
     

    fallenangel1

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 26, 2013
    412
    18
    For or against is fine.. All of you that think it is ok for people to act this way just wait until these people have something that you want.

    /subscribe
     

    thumperdogg

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    37   0   0
    Jul 14, 2011
    1,047
    0
    Hartford City
    What kind of gouger is a stock trader who buys and sells stocks for profit? Is he not a gouger if he buys a stock at $10 and sells if for $12 when it goes up to $20?

    Dealer costs of guns have not risen (for the most part to my knowledge) yet dealers are doubling or tripling their profit. If their prices reflected costs rising, I understand.

    If the oil companies just decided to jack up oil cost because of the shortages we always hear about and cause gas to be $20 a gallon you would be ok with that? Free market and capitalism right?
     
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