Firearms or mental health? You decide

[hick185]

The information used was obtained from thinkprogress.org. I will have a link to the original document. LinkA Timeline Of Mass Shootings In The US Since Columbine | ThinkProgress

This website has a list of the last 30 mass shootings.
One shooting has two shooters.
Total number of shooters 31.
20 committed suicide.

Below is a list of the shooters that did not commit suicide.
2 shooters were shot and killed by police.
2 shooters were shot and survived.

Sulejman Talovic killed by police

Charles Lee "Cookie" Thornton killed by police

Robert Stewart life in prison. Was shot by police. Gunshot wound incapacitated him.

Nidal Malik Hasan in prison. Was shot by a Sergeant and police officer. Gunshot wound incapacitated him.

Jared Lee Loughner life in prison. Subdued by bystanders. Declared mentally unfit to stand trial. Later declared competent pled guilty.

Eduardo Sencion awaits trial date March 25, 2013

Thomas "T.J." Lane awaits trial date January 14, 2013

One L. Goh declared mentally unfit. Additional hearing January 28, 2013

Jake England and Alvin Watts await trial.

James Holmes watch the news…

Suicide is not really considered a mental illness. Some numbers show that more then 90% of suicides have some form of mental disorder. As I see it no sane person wakes up and makes the rational choice to kill themselves. If someone makes the choice to commit suicide, then they must have given it some thought(suicidal thought). Suicidal thoughts have treatments. So if there is a treatment for something then that something must be an illness or disorder. Hopefully you have managed to follow my ramblings. By committing suicide these shooters show that they are NOT free of mental illness or mental disorder. For the those who have managed to follow me I ask again. Firearms or mental illness?

I understand how sensitive the issue of mental illness or disorder is. I have been personally affected by people with mental health issues. I do not mean to offend anyone.

 

[indyjs]

I think treating mental issues is akin to rehabbing criminals in prison. Sounds nice but, not gonna happen.
We also need to differentiate between mental illness and behavior issues.

 

[CathyInBlue]

Psychosis <-- Grand Canyon --> Neurosis

 

[churchmouse]

This society has found reason for any and all poor choices/crimes that we make/commit.
I understand the reason for the post and agree....most of those people were totally whack on some mental level. I can not find a dark enough place in my mind to rationalize how shooting children (or anyone non-deserving) is OK. Just looking into the eyes of these guys in their mug shoots will show us the lights may be on....no one is home. Many had a paper trail history of mental issues. What was done????
Suicide is a way out for many who see no reason to be in this world. Sometimes sever depression will be a reason.
That said, my humble opinion is that most of these freaks are pure cowards and once faced with resistance they off themselves instead of facing their acts.
Mental issues...of course....cowards...absolutely.
How to treat this issue.....I am open to suggestions.

Gun control will not fix this.

 

[Nazgul]

Think you need to be careful with mental illness diagnosis. It would be too easy to expand the criteria so much that guns would effectively be denied to everyone.

Don

 

[Avec]

It is not necessarily the mental illness that is the problem. Oddly, it is the medication the shooters are on.
60 School Shootings Linked To Psychiatric Drugs Over Past 20 Years | Health

As I mentioned in another post, America has always had guns and has always been fairly violent, but mass shootings did not really start until the prevalent use of pharmaceuticals.

 

[hick185]

I understand what you all are saying and thank you for replying. I should have wrote that this is more of less my way of blowing off steam(rant). I was just getting tired of being compared to these murders just for owning firearms. Honestly I shouldn't have really posted it.

 

[Loc n load]

Mental Illness

You are correct about gun laws not fixing the problem. I am a retired LEO (over 30 yrs) and I can tell you from my experiences that there are thousands of people loose in our midst that need to be in a "controlled environment" and on mandatory med's......years ago individual states had mental hospitals, but most of those have long been closed, so we end up with these folks in our midst, or revolving in and out of jails or prisons. The problems worsen when doctors and therapists refuse to disclose to the authorities who they ( medical staff) deem are mentally ill ( patient/doctor confidentiality) and I understand their plight. I know a lot of professional peers who have had therapy and would not want to be reported to their agencies, supervisors or peers or the federal government as a "mental patient". Obviously there are degrees and levels of mental illness, so everybody cannot be lumped into one aggregate group, but that is what we tend to do sometimes.To improve this huge, complex social issue/problem will take a major overhaul of the working relationship between the mental health professionals, law enforcement,government and how we as a society treat our mentally ill.

 

[ERM42]

I can see the need for hipa laws but it seems there should be some method for medical workers to report to police or other proper authorities when someone has the potential to be a danger to themselves or others and not after they have broken the law

 

[churchmouse]

You are correct about gun laws not fixing the problem. I am a retired LEO (over 30 yrs) and I can tell you from my experiences that there are thousands of people loose in our midst that need to be in a "controlled environment" and on mandatory med's......years ago individual states had mental hospitals, but most of those have long been closed, so we end up with these folks in our midst, or revolving in and out of jails or prisons. The problems worsen when doctors and therapists refuse to disclose to the authorities who they ( medical staff) deem are mentally ill ( patient/doctor confidentiality) and I understand their plight. I know a lot of professional peers who have had therapy and would not want to be reported to their agencies, supervisors or peers or the federal government as a "mental patient". Obviously there are degrees and levels of mental illness, so everybody cannot be lumped into one aggregate group, but that is what we tend to do sometimes.To improve this huge, complex social issue/problem will take a major overhaul of the working relationship between the mental health professionals, law enforcement,government and how we as a society treat our mentally ill.

I am sure you have seen so much more of this first hand than Joe average. Folks are so un-aware and in denial as to the extent of this issue.

Welcome to ingo.