I need help I can not find any REAL info on this at all. I need to know if I can spank my kids? dumb question huh? Well... I got a visit today from CPS telling me that they are investigating a report that my child has been spanked, and that corporal punishment in Indiana is a CRIME and I could have my children removed and be placed in JAIL.... If it is illegal than I am guilty. BUT I am having a hard time with this, if I cant spank my kids when they STEAL, KICK, BITE, CURSE, then what am I supposed to do let them grow up wild become drug dealers, prostitutes, wind up dead me being one of these 35 y/o grandparents I DONT THINK SO!!!! If someone could help me out here I am on a limb and dont know what to do anymore...
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Spanked is certainly not illegal. Abuse is illegal.
Communism is alive and well in the US.
Let me go on the record that I am against laws that take away parent's rights.
That said, I will never hit my daughter. I guess she's doomed to a life of crack-ho-ing, prostituting, and if I'm lucky perhaps only some drug-dealing, or maybe only pole-dancing.
I hope she survives me not hitting her.
public servant
Grandmaster
Also read:
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/06100801rdr.pdf
Willis v State of Indiana. What I took from it is you can discipline your child with corporal punishment as long as the punishment fits the crime and the age and health of the child and as long as it does not lead to extreme pain or serious injury.
Of course hitting them with a closed fist or any object not normally used to administer a spanking will be looked down on.
Quoting the Indiana Supreme Court in this decision:
The Model Penal Code provides in relevant part that a parent’s use of force is justifiable if:
(a) the force is used for the purpose of safeguarding or promoting the welfare of the minor, including the prevention or punishment of his misconduct; and
(b) the force used is not designed to cause or known to create a substantial risk of causing death, serious bodily injury, disfigurement, extreme pain or mental distress or gross degradation.
Also:
In determining whether force or confinement is reasonable for the control, training, or education of a child, the following factors are to be considered:
(a) whether the actor is a parent; (b) the age, sex, and physical and mental condition of the child;
(c) the nature of his offense and his apparent motive;
(d) the influence of his example upon other children of the same family or group;
(e) whether the force or confinement is reasonably necessary and appropriate to compel obedience to a proper command;
(f) whether it is disproportionate to the offense, unnecessarily degrading, or likely to cause serious or permanent harm.
You should really read the entire decision though.
My personal opinion. If they need their butt spanked....spank them. As long as you're not hitting them with a closed fist or with enough force to do bodily injury, I have no problem with it. That's just personal opinion though. If you don't believe in spanking your kids....that's your right as their parent. But when I correct mine....mind your own business as long as I'm not beating them.
Thanks Cwood. Good find. I have mixed feelings about CPS. I feel for you Jhawk. I hope I never find myself in your situation. I have heard some scary stuff about CPS. I'm thinking it would be in your best interests to contact a lawyer immediately.
Every time I swat one of my kids on the behind in public I worry that some idiot with different views than my own is going to call CPS. While I do in part feel that they are a needed service. I also feel that they have way to much power. I wish you the best and hope all turns out well.
Whatever you do don't turn CPS away from your home. Then the gestapo will kick in your door. Hold your family at gunpoint and take your child.
Every time I swat one of my kids on the behind in public I worry that some idiot with different views than my own is going to call CPS. While I do in part feel that they are a needed service. I also feel that they have way to much power. I wish you the best and hope all turns out well.
Whatever you do don't turn CPS away from your home. Then the gestapo will kick in your door. Hold your family at gunpoint and take your child.
Last edited:
CulpeperMM
Master
JHAWK that is just a nightmare situation. i pray that you all come out of this OK.
I am NOT a lawyer!!! ... however, i would have to call bullsh!t on the "corporal punishment in Indiana is a CRIME".
Nowhere in the Indiana code does it prohibit a parent from using corporal punishment. It does prohibit some state facilities from doing so. Not parents.
Information Maintained by the Office of Code Revision Indiana Legislative Services Agency
04/16/2009 10:02:46 PM EDT IC 31-34
ARTICLE 34. JUVENILE LAW: CHILDREN IN NEED OF SERVICES
Indiana Code 31-34-1
IC 31-34-1-15
Effect of chapter on use of corporal punishment or religious practices
Sec. 15. This chapter does not do any of the following:
(1) Limit the right of a parent, guardian, or custodian of a child to use reasonable corporal punishment when disciplining the child.
(2) Limit the lawful practice or teaching of religious beliefs.
As added by P.L.1-1997, SEC.17.
I would call a lawyer, and allow him to notify the school board of their error.
NOT LEGAL ADVISE, JUST MY
I am NOT a lawyer!!! ... however, i would have to call bullsh!t on the "corporal punishment in Indiana is a CRIME".
Nowhere in the Indiana code does it prohibit a parent from using corporal punishment. It does prohibit some state facilities from doing so. Not parents.
Information Maintained by the Office of Code Revision Indiana Legislative Services Agency
04/16/2009 10:02:46 PM EDT IC 31-34
ARTICLE 34. JUVENILE LAW: CHILDREN IN NEED OF SERVICES
Indiana Code 31-34-1
IC 31-34-1-15
Effect of chapter on use of corporal punishment or religious practices
Sec. 15. This chapter does not do any of the following:
(1) Limit the right of a parent, guardian, or custodian of a child to use reasonable corporal punishment when disciplining the child.
(2) Limit the lawful practice or teaching of religious beliefs.
As added by P.L.1-1997, SEC.17.
I would call a lawyer, and allow him to notify the school board of their error.
NOT LEGAL ADVISE, JUST MY
I consider that SHTF
public servant
Grandmaster
Good luck. Keep us posted, please?
The ex wife and I were at odds and I had custody of my daughter. I had to spank her and the ex didn't take kindly to that and called child protection. I got a knock on my door by a woman from the agency that asked to check out the story and this is what she told me.
"Just don't leave any bruises"
So, that is the key if you are in a situation like I was and want to stay out of trouble.
I have learned a few things through the years and are as follows:
One funny note. After the visit, I tried to control my kid one night by raising my voice instead of spanking. Well, the neighbor called the police and they knocked on my door and asked if everything was OK. (I know I didn't have to but) I told them to come inside and check. Told them that my daughter was giving me trouble going to bed. They told her to mind her father. When they left, my daughter, with eyes like saucers, says to me, "Dad, they had GUNS!" I had absolutely no problems from her for quite some time.
P.S. She is now a Marine and her Dad is very very proud of her.
"Just don't leave any bruises"
So, that is the key if you are in a situation like I was and want to stay out of trouble.
I have learned a few things through the years and are as follows:
- If your child knows you mean what you are saying, they will obey.
- You have to follow through.
- Be loving, fair, but be firm.
- If children are not given a structure to live in, they will spend their energy trying to figure one out so it is actually easier for them if you provide it.
One funny note. After the visit, I tried to control my kid one night by raising my voice instead of spanking. Well, the neighbor called the police and they knocked on my door and asked if everything was OK. (I know I didn't have to but) I told them to come inside and check. Told them that my daughter was giving me trouble going to bed. They told her to mind her father. When they left, my daughter, with eyes like saucers, says to me, "Dad, they had GUNS!" I had absolutely no problems from her for quite some time.
P.S. She is now a Marine and her Dad is very very proud of her.
Jhawk, that sounds a bit odd to me. There has to be something else going on to prompt the call. I don't mean you did something, I mean who ever placed the call said something to them. A friend of mine is an investigator for CPS in indy, and he and I have had several conversations about punishing children properly. I would call him about this but he is presently under the emply of the Federal Government instead of the state at this time.
Spankings have always seemed less about pain than they were about letting the kid know you are serious. Because causing them physical pain is so at odds with a parents normarl behavior it helps to really serve as a wake up call. And as the child gets older the embarassment certainly adds into everything. To this day my mother will still flip me in the side of the head if She doesn't approve of what I say or do, including the word "crap" by the way. Then again when I was growing up my mother would "count" before she would do anything. However she assumed that I knew better so that was one, and if I heard three then I was cooked, so I went to Kindergarden fearing the number 2.
Spankings have always seemed less about pain than they were about letting the kid know you are serious. Because causing them physical pain is so at odds with a parents normarl behavior it helps to really serve as a wake up call. And as the child gets older the embarassment certainly adds into everything. To this day my mother will still flip me in the side of the head if She doesn't approve of what I say or do, including the word "crap" by the way. Then again when I was growing up my mother would "count" before she would do anything. However she assumed that I knew better so that was one, and if I heard three then I was cooked, so I went to Kindergarden fearing the number 2.
It's happened. Story in a nutshell.
A mans daughter was leaving the home in her car. His son was running alongside the car. He fell and hit his head. This man who had military medical training checked his son and took him inside.
Neighbor had called ambulance. Ambulance showed up. Entered mans home without permission. Ambulance crew got mad when dad wouldn't let them take son to hospital. EMT decides to call CPS. CPS shows up. After conversation with CPS man asks them to leave. Tells them he will take son to hospital if he feels it is needed. CPS comes back with LE. LE holds entire family at gunpoint. Takes son from home to hospital. Hospital releases son due to non serious injury.
This is the crap that has me terrified of CPS.
now that you mention it they said they need to see the inside of my house my fridge cabinets kids room My child has a few problems and has been in and out of mental homes due to issues and I can only assume that it may have something to due with that but I will never know who made the complaint or why. what I do know is that it is 11:00 pm and my child is bouncing off the walls and telling me "you cant woop me......I'll call the police" so I think I will do as hoosier8 did and make a call to non emergecy...this is all B.S.
I guess the old saying I brought you into this world has no use anymore.
public servant
Grandmaster
Right after the discipline dial 911 and hand them the phone.
public servant
Grandmaster
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