Cops do NOT know gun laws . . . share your story

[melensdad]

I have been watching the Open Carry in Terre Haute thread where it has been reported that local LEO's are claiming there is a city ordnance against open carry. It got me to thinking that many police officers simply do not know gun laws.

I had a gun stolen. This is a true story.

I've always kept a gun locked in my desk at work. My locked desk is inside a locked office. I had to have surgery and was off work for 3 months. When I returned to work my desk was unlocked, my gun was missing. So I called my managers, asked if one of them was playing a joke on me. Nope. I then contacted the police. Town of Highland, IN. They sent over a brand spanking new, still shiny from the academy, cop-chick to take a report.

The first question she asked me: "Was the gun registered?"

"Huh?" I replied.

"Was the gun registered?" she repeated as if I did not hear her the first time.

"With who?" I replied.

"Huh?" she said.

"This is Indiana, we don't register guns in this state" I replied.

This happened some time ago, I never did get the gun back, but I wonder if she even realized that we can carry guns in this state? Fortunately I know a few officers in Highland, one of the detectives called me later, he apologized and also turned the case over to the FBI or ATF because the suspect was an Illiniois resident, potentially making it a cross state line issue. The suspect was a member of the cleaning crew who cleaned my building. I was reimbursed for the gun by the cleaning company but the gun is still on the streets.

 

[VUPDblue]

Yay! A cop bashing thread! I wanna play, I wanna play...

 

[melensdad]

Well I hope it doesn't turn into a cop bashing thread. But I did start it to show that police do not necessarily know everything about the law. While the Terra Haute Open Carry thread discusses one issue with one department, I thought this might be a good place to deposit a wide variety of stories from around the state. Again, not trying to destroy the integrity of the police, but perhaps to educate the gun owners that the police may be unaware of specific gun laws.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Do you want the whole list or just the top ten?

 

[VUPDblue]

A lot of boys and girls in blue do not know all the intricacies of a lot of parts of the law. The reality is that there are so many ordinances and addendums to so many different laws, the police do not have the time or resources to know each and every one of them. That's why we have lawyers and courts. It's just part of the system. That being said, I have only rarely heard that an arrest was effected based upon lack of knowledge of specific gun laws. Sure Jonny Law may stop you and ask questions, or in your case ask incorrect questions, but they are *usually* extremely careful to stay within the law on a possible arrest. Hell, I still run into officers who think machineguns are illegal across the board. When I tell one that I paid my tax stamp for it, they usualy ask "what's that"?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

The reality is that there are so many ordinances and addendums to so many different laws, the police do not have the time or resources to know each and every one of them.

Ah, yes, the whole "we police shouldn't be expected to know" defense. The whole "too many laws to know" never works for my guys. I always get a 26 year old deputy prosecutor telling me, while holding on to their lapels, that "ignorance of the law is no excuse."

Don't buy this excuse because my guys never get a break but only pompous lectures from cops and prosecutors. Funny how "ignorance" works for the po-po and not my guys. Maybe if it were equally applied.

I'm going to start making my guys rent some cop uniforms from a party store to wear at their initial hearings. Then I'll get some nolles.

Oh, well, I keep swinging.

 

[Glock Lover]

It's a shame if cops don't know. When we go through academy we sit through countless hours of law classes, and take tests on those classes, and then are quizzed again when you get out by your Field Training officer, and gun laws are a part of those classes. If you've been through academy you should know the laws on guns, they are covered fairly well in Indiana.

 

[VUPDblue]

I challenge you guys to ask a cop, any cop, what the local ordinance is on grass height. I bet not 1 in 10 could tell you. Ask them what the percentage of window tint in Indiana is legal. Maybe one in 5 could tell you. Ask them how long a car can sit in one spot before it is considered abandoned. Maybe 8 in 10 could tell you. All I am saying is that not every single beat cop knows each and every detail of every single law. Also, they will be very careful in researching their facts before an arrest is effected in a case where they are not 100% sure from the get-go.
Also, keep this in mind. The laws that cops can/have to enforce multiplied as you go down the "totem pole". For example, State Police can only enforce state law, whereas a City Police officer must be able to enforce city ordinances, county ordinance, and state law. At the university where I worked, officers had to enforce school policy, city ordinances, county ordinances as well as state law. That's a lot of laws to be 100% knowledgeable of.

 

[melensdad]

AGAIN, I do not intend to see this thread turn into a cop bashing thread. I certainly hope it does not. My intent is simply to point out that police do not know every gun law and I'm hoping that those who reply to this thread will share real stories.

 

[VUPDblue]

Ok, I'll go. So I walk into the local PD where I used to work to visit my old partner. He knew I was coming and bringing my suppressed SBR'd 9mm AR. We go to his office (he's now the Lt.) and he's checking the rifle out. He calls in some of his patrolmen who he thought'd get a kick out of the thing. 3 officers come in and they like it, but all want to know how I'm ballsy enough to be carrying around a 'sawed off' rifle and a silencer. Needless to say, every officer in that department (there's only a dozen of 'em) now knows the laws on NFA items

 

[rhino]

I challenge you guys to ask a cop, any cop, what the local ordinance is on grass height. I bet not 1 in 10 could tell you. Ask them what the percentage of window tint in Indiana is legal. Maybe one in 5 could tell you. Ask them how long a car can sit in one spot before it is considered abandoned. Maybe 8 in 10 could tell you. All I am saying is that not every single beat cop knows each and every detail of every single law.

Which is why 1) they shouldn't give legal advice when people ask them; and 2) really, really why they shouldn't "enforce" laws they don't understand or that don't exist. The apocryphal (to be kind) ordinance banning open carry in Terre Haute is a good example.

None of that is bashing, by the way.

 

[bwframe]

The Brown County Sheriff stated that it was illegal to carry in your vehicle while picking your kids up from school. To give him credit, he basically went on to infer "don't ask, don't tell." A good, common sense, approach to a problem that he wasn't aware had already been solved legally.

 

[sparky241]

I have been watching the Open Carry in Terre Haute thread where it has been reported that local LEO's are claiming there is a city ordnance against open carry. It got me to thinking that many police officers simply do not know gun laws.

I had a gun stolen. This is a true story.

I've always kept a gun locked in my desk at work. My locked desk is inside a locked office. I had to have surgery and was off work for 3 months. When I returned to work my desk was unlocked, my gun was missing. So I called my managers, asked if one of them was playing a joke on me. Nope. I then contacted the police. Town of Highland, IN. They sent over a brand spanking new, still shiny from the academy, cop-chick to take a report.

The first question she asked me: "Was the gun registered?"

"Huh?" I replied.

"Was the gun registered?" she repeated as if I did not hear her the first time.

"With who?" I replied.

"Huh?" she said.

"This is Indiana, we don't register guns in this state" I replied.

This happened some time ago, I never did get the gun back, but I wonder if she even realized that we can carry guns in this state? Fortunately I know a few officers in Highland, one of the detectives called me later, he apologized and also turned the case over to the FBI or ATF because the suspect was an Illiniois resident, potentially making it a cross state line issue. The suspect was a member of the cleaning crew who cleaned my building. I was reimbursed for the gun by the cleaning company but the gun is still on the streets.

yeah highland police arent the brightest crayons in the box

 

[AFA1CY]

>>> snip <<<

The first question she asked me: "Was the gun registered?"

"Huh?" I replied.

"Was the gun registered?" she repeated as if I did not hear her the first time.

"With who?" I replied.

"Huh?" she said.

"This is Indiana, we don't register guns in this state" I replied. >>> snip <<<

Just to give the devil his due, you can register a handgun if you so wish. One of mine is registered with IMPD (formally IPD) because it was passed down to me from my uncle and he had it registered and requestred that I transfer it. However registration is voluntary.

 

[TomN]

Oh that reminds me of something! You guys remember the state form you had to fill out when buying a handgun? I remember doing it around 15 years ago or so. Anyway the FFL would send the pink copy to your local dept and then they were supposed to either destroy it or send it to you? Well South Bend PD was keeping them and forming their own version of gun registration. Someone found out and sued them. They won and SB had to destroy their copies. I found that interesting since I lived in SB at the time.

 

[rhino]

Many police departments did the exact same thing (I never received any of my copies, for instance). Those that were not sued probably still have the paper copies. Those that were sued, probably have some kind of copy, either digital or otherwise.

I'm more concerned about people registration than gun registration at this point.

 

[SavageEagle]

People registration? Like the "Terror Watch List"?

 

[HiRoller]

Just to give the devil his due, you can register a handgun if you so wish. One of mine is registered with IMPD (formally IPD) because it was passed down to me from my uncle and he had it registered and requestred that I transfer it. However registration is voluntary.

Try walking into the City/County Building with pistol in a shoebox to get it registered these days.

 

[AFA1CY]

Try walking into the City/County Building with pistol in a shoebox to get it registered these days.

Good point. I wonder how they do handle that?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

The only personal story I have is my encounter with the Wheatfield, Indiana Town Marshal. I've told it before, let me know if anyone does not know it.