Baseball League Rejects Gun Dealer as Sponsor, is hypocritical on issues

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  • melensdad

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    I thought this pretty much sucked!
    Baseball League Rejects Gun Dealer as Sponsor
    Updated: 20 hours 10 minutes ago
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    N.J. Youth Baseball League Rejects Gun Dealer as Sponsor - AOL News
    Michelle Ruiz
    Contributor
    AOL News

    (March 5) -- When Matt Carmel applied to sponsor a youth baseball team in his hometown of Maplewood, N.J., he got an answer he didn't expect: No.

    The South Orange-Maplewood Baseball Committee rejected Carmel's application by a vote of 8 to 1, saying Carmel's business, a licensed gun dealership named Constitution Arms, could spark "controversy" and "backlash" from players' parents.

    "They're just hypocrites," Carmel told AOL News of the volunteer committee that oversees the local Babe Ruth/Cal Ripken baseball league. "They want this rainbow, welcoming, all-inclusive community ... but they really don't want diversity."

    Carmel applied for sponsorship in October, offering to contribute the $300 fee to sponsor a team in the league his 10-year-old son, Kalman, played in last spring. But after the committee vote and weeks of letters, Carmel learned his rejection was final on Sunday. It was the first time in recent memory that the South Orange-Maplewood committee had voted on a potential sponsor, much less rejected one.

    "I voted against it," Craig Gruber, secretary of the committee, told the Newark Star-Ledger. "Personally ... given the nature of that business, I'm certain there'd be quite a bit of contention. We don't need the headache. ... We have our hands full with deciding whether infield fly rules should be in effect for 9-year-olds."

    Carmel told AOL News he won't pursue the issue further, saying it appears the decision is final. Nevertheless, he thinks it's unfair that his firearms business prevented him from contributing to a youth organization in his community.

    "I might not object if they had a policy that said 'no guns, no tobacco, no sexual innuendo,' " he said. "But I'm galled by the fact that they would accept other sponsors who are clearly inappropriate."

    Among those sponsors, according to Carmel, is Cluck-U Chicken, which he said features sexually suggestive advertising, as well as other liquor and tobacco stores that have served as team sponsors.


    Carmel said his rejection came with a counteroffer: He could sponsor a team, if he dropped the "arms" from his business name, Constitution Arms.

    "I said, 'How about guns?' " Carmel told AOL News. "How could I be the sponsor with just the name 'Constitution'? Is that my justice system or just my evening walk?"

    Kate Schmidt, deputy director of The Baird, South Orange's recreation agency, told the Star-Ledger that according to the rule book for the Babe Ruth/Cal Ripken league, there should be "meticulous care" in selecting sponsors that will mind the "welfare of youth."

    Though he said he wanted to sponsor a youth baseball team, Carmel said he will agree to act as a sponsor for the Morris Rugby Football Club in Montville, N.J., which reached out to him after learning of his rejection in Maplewood.

    "They said, 'We'd love to have you as a sponsor,' " Carmel said. "I'm going to take them up on their offer."

    Carmel's son decided against playing this spring -- but Carmel said 10-year-old Kalman wasn't affected by the committee's decision.

    "He knows what Daddy does for a living," Carmel said. "He's a good shot, too."​
     

    Phil502

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    Wow, what a bunch of jerks, selling guns is very unsavory. I wonder if he could sue them for something. Maybe other sponsors will pull out after they read this story, that would be bad for the kids if they do though.
     

    T-rav

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    Its funny how the world works now, he cant sponsor something for the good of the community because it has the word "arm" on the end of it but yet Id almost bet they would be ok with something of less moral value as a sponsor.
     

    purple72

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    I just engraved a handful of plaques for a Little League team that was sponsored by a gun shop. And I put the sponsors name on, and they said nobody had any complaints. I was a bit suprised, but oh well. I could fully understand this situation if it was in California.
     

    jedi

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    I might get flames for this & so be it. But I don't see anything wrong with that the little league organization did. They have a right to say YES/NO to any sponsor they wish. It's their loss of a SPONSOR if they say no. They are not hurting anyone but themselves by saying no.

    Lets put it another way. Say INGO holds a Spring Gun Shooting contest and we get sponsors like Front Sites, LEO Website and The Brady Campaign to ban guns that apply for sponsorship of the event. Are you telling me that YOU (all of you that are blasting the little league) will accept The Brady Campaign as a sponsor for the event?

    REALLY?

    From a biz pint of view what they organization did is stupid. They just lost MONEY and money is money is money. If that is how they want to be. Fine. It's their "ball" and they can play by their rules does not mean I or the sponsor has to play with them and their ball. Besides some one else is ALWAYS willing to take your money. In this case a football organization.

    So fire away if you want. I say leave the baseball organization alone & by that I mean really a-l-o-n-e eventually they reject enough sponsors and they won't have no money and go bye-bye.
     

    TopDog

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    Just to play devils advocate. While I was reading this it occurred to me if I were on a committee approving sponsors for whatever I would welcome sponsors like PSS, Bradis, etc but if Don's guns applied I would reject it. How would that look if Don's was the only one that applied? On the surface it would like I was rejecting a gun shop and not a business I was suspicious of. I'm just saying. I have no idea how the gun shop in the OP is viewed but there might be more to this than what is seen on the surface. I don't think that is what is going on here, I bet the gun shop in question is very reputable. But hey give the committee the benefit of the doubt. Just something to think about, it would be nice to have more information.

    I'm a big rugby fan and to hear that the rugby team stepped up to the plate, so to speak gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling.

    KeeponRuckin.jpg
     

    wtfd661

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    Just to play devils advocate. While I was reading this it occurred to me if I were on a committee approving sponsors for whatever I would welcome sponsors like PSS, Bradis, etc but if Don's guns applied I would reject it. How would that look if Don's was the only one that applied? On the surface it would like I was rejecting a gun shop and not a business I was suspicious of. I'm just saying. I have no idea how the gun shop in the OP is viewed but there might be more to this than what is seen on the surface. I don't think that is what is going on here, I bet the gun shop in question is very reputable. But hey give the committee the benefit of the doubt. Just something to think about, it would be nice to have more information.

    I'm a big rugby fan and to hear that the rugby team stepped up to the plate, so to speak gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling.

    KeeponRuckin.jpg


    According to the OP,they said the would accept him as a sponsor if he dropped the word ARMS in his business name so sounds like to me the only problem they have is the connection to a gun shop.

    Personally I think its a crock of :poop: that they wouldn't accept him as a supporter seeing as how they have accepted liquor sales and sexually suggestive advertisers. So sounds like they are OK with underage drinking and teenage sex just not with those evil guns.
     

    mettle

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    I thought this pretty much sucked!
    Baseball League Rejects Gun Dealer as Sponsor
    Updated: 20 hours 10 minutes ago
    Print Text Size E-mail More
    N.J. Youth Baseball League Rejects Gun Dealer as Sponsor - AOL News
    Michelle Ruiz
    Contributor
    AOL News

    (March 5) -- When Matt Carmel applied to sponsor a youth baseball team in his hometown of Maplewood, N.J., he got an answer he didn't expect: No.

    The South Orange-Maplewood Baseball Committee rejected Carmel's application by a vote of 8 to 1, saying Carmel's business, a licensed gun dealership named Constitution Arms, could spark "controversy" and "backlash" from players' parents.

    "They're just hypocrites," Carmel told AOL News of the volunteer committee that oversees the local Babe Ruth/Cal Ripken baseball league. "They want this rainbow, welcoming, all-inclusive community ... but they really don't want diversity."

    Carmel applied for sponsorship in October, offering to contribute the $300 fee to sponsor a team in the league his 10-year-old son, Kalman, played in last spring. But after the committee vote and weeks of letters, Carmel learned his rejection was final on Sunday. It was the first time in recent memory that the South Orange-Maplewood committee had voted on a potential sponsor, much less rejected one.

    "I voted against it," Craig Gruber, secretary of the committee, told the Newark Star-Ledger. "Personally ... given the nature of that business, I'm certain there'd be quite a bit of contention. We don't need the headache. ... We have our hands full with deciding whether infield fly rules should be in effect for 9-year-olds."

    Carmel told AOL News he won't pursue the issue further, saying it appears the decision is final. Nevertheless, he thinks it's unfair that his firearms business prevented him from contributing to a youth organization in his community.

    "I might not object if they had a policy that said 'no guns, no tobacco, no sexual innuendo,' " he said. "But I'm galled by the fact that they would accept other sponsors who are clearly inappropriate."

    Among those sponsors, according to Carmel, is Cluck-U Chicken, which he said features sexually suggestive advertising, as well as other liquor and tobacco stores that have served as team sponsors.


    Carmel said his rejection came with a counteroffer: He could sponsor a team, if he dropped the "arms" from his business name, Constitution Arms.

    "I said, 'How about guns?' " Carmel told AOL News. "How could I be the sponsor with just the name 'Constitution'? Is that my justice system or just my evening walk?"

    Kate Schmidt, deputy director of The Baird, South Orange's recreation agency, told the Star-Ledger that according to the rule book for the Babe Ruth/Cal Ripken league, there should be "meticulous care" in selecting sponsors that will mind the "welfare of youth."

    Though he said he wanted to sponsor a youth baseball team, Carmel said he will agree to act as a sponsor for the Morris Rugby Football Club in Montville, N.J., which reached out to him after learning of his rejection in Maplewood.

    "They said, 'We'd love to have you as a sponsor,' " Carmel said. "I'm going to take them up on their offer."

    Carmel's son decided against playing this spring -- but Carmel said 10-year-old Kalman wasn't affected by the committee's decision.

    "He knows what Daddy does for a living," Carmel said. "He's a good shot, too."​

    good for his son, standing by his father and the right side of sanity! :yesway:
     

    Hotdoger

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    I might get flames for this & so be it. But I don't see anything wrong with that the little league organization did. They have a right to say YES/NO to any sponsor they wish. It's their loss of a SPONSOR if they say no. They are not hurting anyone but themselves by saying no.

    Lets put it another way. Say INGO holds a Spring Gun Shooting contest and we get sponsors like Front Sites, LEO Website and The Brady Campaign to ban guns that apply for sponsorship of the event. Are you telling me that YOU (all of you that are blasting the little league) will accept The Brady Campaign as a sponsor for the event?

    REALLY?

    From a biz pint of view what they organization did is stupid. They just lost MONEY and money is money is money. If that is how they want to be. Fine. It's their "ball" and they can play by their rules does not mean I or the sponsor has to play with them and their ball. Besides some one else is ALWAYS willing to take your money. In this case a football organization.

    So fire away if you want. I say leave the baseball organization alone & by that I mean really a-l-o-n-e eventually they reject enough sponsors and they won't have no money and go bye-bye.


    So the the leagues hypocrisy does not bother you?
    IE. League takes liquor, and tobacco sponsorship money but not gun store money?

    The Brady Campaign would never sponsor a shooting event . To be a good analogy there has to be some truth in it. :):
     

    jedi

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    So the the leagues hypocrisy does not bother you?
    IE. League takes liquor, and tobacco sponsorship money but not gun store money?

    Nope. It's their (the leagues) rules/decision if they want to take booze & tobacco money & not gun money. Those are their values and who am I to judge them since they are not harming anyone but themselves as they just decided not to take money.

    As for the sponsor (from a biz point of view) he has gone somewhere where his biz is welcomed. So he will get his tax deduction anyways.

    As a gun supporters (him the owner personally) should as a private citizen (not biz man) raise hell about it and push all other "gun owners" in that league to take their kids out and/or ask the other sponsors to pull out as well. This will hurt the little league but so be it.
     

    Phil502

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    He's being kept from participating, it's a little more than a just a donation. What if they said they did not want a Black owned business?
     

    CarmelHP

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    There are actually gun shops left in New Jersey? It must be like trying to run a kosher deli in Nazi Germany.
     
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    He has more than this one opportunity to take money out of the pocket of the youth league if he would wish to. They lost their $300 in sponsorship, but he can choose to not have his son participate in any fundraisers held for the benefit of the league. This may include ones that are run or organized through school corporation. He doesn't have to say a word against the league to other sponsors or parents of children playing.

    Concession stand purchases benefiting the league? No.
    Clothing purchases benefiting the league? No.
    Equipment purchases benefiting the league? No.

    I don't know what their concession stand charges (if they have one), but I know that we dropped probably $100-$200 over the course of the season between my four family members on snacks, sandwiches, popcorn, candy, etc. None of that includes buying my children shirts, insurance, supplying equipment to the needy poor children and a bunch of other things we did.
     

    jedi

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    He's being kept from participating, it's a little more than a just a donation. What if they said they did not want a Black owned business?

    Sure but the little legaue is a private organization and does not get any "government" money (ie. federal, state, or local) [at least the one my kid sis was in up here was like that] as such as a private organization they have the right to make whatever craZy runs they want to make.

    It's the same concept that the country clubs use (IE; you can only join if you have a certain income or higher which means only the very rich) to keep the general punlic out.

    If we get the "gov" involved in this & I'm not saying you (Phil502) are saying that but if the "gov" gets involved then what is it to stop from getting involved in our items & tell us what to do in every aspect of our lives?

    As for if they don't want "black owners" so be it. Again it's their club and their rules. It could that the league is for whites only. Heck East Chicago at one point had a hispanic only little league! You could only join if one or both of your parents were hispanic!!! How is that any different that what the OP's baseball league is doing?

    It would be stupid to put those type of restrictions "no black biz", "no gun biz", "no female own biz", etc.. if I was in charge of that little league. Money is money is money is money and all the money goes to help with the program. But it looks like those folks have lost site of that.
     

    Indy_Guy_77

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    If I read the article correctly, he's much more upset at the seemed hypocrisy than at the rejection itself.

    I'm SURE that the guy understands the freedom of a private enterprise to make the choices... But when it deems certain advertisers / sponsors as "wholesome", those shilling liquor and tobacco. It's a very easy argument to make that alcohol and tobacco cause more harm to all of America's citizens than do firearms... Yet they're singling out the firearms for denial.

    So, the point is that yes the guy's a little upset at his rejection, but he'd much rather the hypocrisy be exposed for what it is.

    -J-
     

    opus1776

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    What about Chico's Bail Bonds??? :laugh:

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