.40 s&w brass life test today

[shibumiseeker]

Update 4-10-2010 Test is done, see page 4...

Well, I actually started yesterday but ran into technical difficulties.

In the ongoing saga of Shibumiseeker testing brass to "destruction/holy cow I've shot it so many times I'm afraid to do more/well, I lost that one", I decided a test of a piece of .40 s&w was in order. I started yesterday but after 5 loadings I lost the brass (which is hard to do in a small shooting shack building...). For those who don't know, my reloading shack and range hut are one building, I can load and turn around and shoot.

So:

Dies- Lee 4 die set with FCD. Expander set to just allow bullet seating, FCD set to provide light crimp. Press is a Lee Turret.

Brass- Winchester range pickup courtesy of Dr. Falken (thanks dude!) Extractor marks make it look once fired. Starting length of .810

Primer- CCI 500 Small Pistol Primer

Powder- 6.5gr of Power Pistol

Bullet- 180gr Ranier Plated flat nose (truncated cone)

Gun- Walther PPS

I loaded and shot this thing 20 times! After load 10 I was inspecting the brass closely in strong light after each resize before priming. After load 20 (for a total of 21 loading assuming it was once fired) the rim was pretty chewed up by the extractor and the mouth was dinged all to crap, but there was no evidence of splitting. I stopped the test because I was getting bored. I may resume it tomorrow, may not since afterall, 20 loadings is quite a few. Ending length was .820, so it grew .01 in the time I shot it.

So there ya are. It's a tough job, but someone has to do it. On a good note, I am starting to be able to shoot the PPS much better, I had about half the rounds on the black at 50' and all were on paper and all but one inside the 6 ring.

Just FYI, I have a batch of 10mm that is now on load 4, a batch of .50bmg that is on load 5, and several batches of .308 and .223 that are being shot first through semi auto guns then bolt actiions. Stay tuned to Shibumi's brass destruction channel for updates as they happen! Search the archives to find my test of .458 socom for HornadayLNL and my .50bmg test to destruction!

That is all. No, this is not a 4.1 joke.

 

[Cat-Herder]

i've shot and reloaded my .40 brass so many times, i just don't care to log the times it's been fired any more. i still keep track of my .357s, but there's so much of the .40 (and i keep picking up more), it's more trouble than it's worth.
it's nice to know i can get a good 20 loadings out of one before boredom sets in...

 

[HICKMAN]

good info, jealous of the shack

 

[Disposable Heart]

I do not think folks give:
1. .40 it's due: It won't blow up automatically in Glox. All the stories I see are crazy loads, police shooters (and some of the horror stories about those guys and how well they maintain their guns, not all, but some). It is a great cartridge, I kind of like a less recoil, cheaper 10mm!
2. Lee dies it's due: They are good dies! They aren't super, uber, competition dies, but they do work, they will size the cartridge IF PROPERLY set up (something alot of bargain basement reloaders fail to do, couple that plus wild loads).

Thanks for the post Shibumi!

 

[Stimp]

Nice test and good information.
I've wondered the same things. I just keep on loading mine until the day I finally see failure.

 

[shibumiseeker]

10 more!

Ten more rounds through that brass today for a total of 30 rounds loaded plus one factory. The rim is even more chewed and I wouldn't be surprised to see a FTE one of these times. The mouth of the case is becoming sharply beveled but has not grown anymore, it's still at .820 The primer pocket still feels the same, though this doesn't surprise me since this is a fairly light loading.

 

[Cat-Herder]

that's very good to know! i guess i can pretty much stop buying used .40 brass now!

 

[shibumiseeker]

that's very good to know! i guess i can pretty much stop buying used .40 brass now!

I hear ya. At a conservative guess I'm going to lose them before they become unloadable! Obviously this being a statistical sample of one it's not as useful, but I was mostly just having fun. I'll probably do another set tomorrow.

Those 500 cases Dr. Falken gave me should last a long time at the rate I shoot .40. Now if I could just have someone bless me with a bunch of 10mm brass

 

[Cam]

I do not think folks give:
1. .40 it's due: It won't blow up automatically in Glox. All the stories I see are crazy loads, police shooters (and some of the horror stories about those guys and how well they maintain their guns, not all, but some). It is a great cartridge, I kind of like a less recoil, cheaper 10mm!
2. Lee dies it's due: They are good dies! They aren't super, uber, competition dies, but they do work, they will size the cartridge IF PROPERLY set up (something alot of bargain basement reloaders fail to do, couple that plus wild loads).

Thanks for the post Shibumi!

 

[kwatters]

I would love to see a comparison between the brass and nickel plated. I have plenty of Nickel if you need a donor...

 

[redneckmedic]

Great Write up ....However

 

[shibumiseeker]

I would love to see a comparison between the brass and nickel plated. I have plenty of Nickel if you need a donor...

I have some nickel plated out of the batch, however what I'd need is a couple of batches, say 5 each of nickel and brass from the same manufacturer as I find there are more variance between manufacturers than plated vs not. OTOH, it has been my experience that nickel plated brass doesn't last as long. The main reason for nickel plating other than bling is because of smoother loading and extraction and the extra corrosion resistance. If you can supply nickel and brass from the same brass manufacturer I'd be happy to run a side by side comparison.

Great Write up ....However

I *knew* someone was going to want pics! Ok:

 

[kwatters]

I was able to find 5 or more each of Winchester, although these show some unsupported chamber buldge. Does that matter?

 

[excursion12]

Do at least 30 pcs. Then your research will be statistically useful. Lots to explain but 30 is enough to make for good assumptions on brass life. I will come help you shoot if you get bored pulling the trigger!

 

[mhs]

Have you considered trying this with a Glock?

 

[shibumiseeker]

I was able to find 5 or more each of Winchester, although these show some unsupported chamber buldge. Does that matter?

Nope! PM me and I'll send you a mailing address!

 

[shibumiseeker]

Do at least 30 pcs. Then your research will be statistically useful. Lots to explain but 30 is enough to make for good assumptions on brass life. I will come help you shoot if you get bored pulling the trigger!

Oh no you don't! I'm educated regarding statistics and I'm a scientist, I understand how to set up a proper experiment. I'm doing this for fun and empiricism, you're going to have to pay me to get me to document and run that experiment!

 

[shibumiseeker]

Have you considered trying this with a Glock?

If I owned a .40 Glock I'd be shooting my reloads with a Lone Wolf barrel like I do with my 10mm Glocks .

 

[mhs]

If I owned a .40 Glock I'd be shooting my reloads with a Lone Wolf barrel like I do with my 10mm Glocks .

I used to reload once-fired brass up to 4 times for 173,000 pf USPSA loads with 180 grain bullets. I never had a problem doing that with a stock model 35. Now that I'm shooting minor I'm guessing that I'll have almost unlimited case life.

 

[shibumiseeker]

I used to reload once-fired brass up to 4 times for 173,000 pf USPSA loads with 180 grain bullets. I never had a problem doing that with a stock model 35. Now that I'm shooting minor I'm guessing that I'll have almost unlimited case life.

Without speaking to unsupported chambers: My experience has been that with light loads I can get phenomenal case life. I was inspired to run these tests years ago from a guy on rec.guns who started running batches and posting the results. I don't remember how many loadings he got off some .38sp brass but it was incredible. One .22-250 I did in a bolt action rifle with neck sizing only got me 76 loadings before the neck split.

I figure with semi-auto pistol rounds that I lost my brass before it was past its life, but now I have a completely enclosed shooting shack so I lose a lot less brass. I'm probably going to stick with 10 loadings or so before I toss 'em just because .40 brass is so easy to come by.

The one reason I use LW barrels in my G20 and 29 is not because I'm afraid of the unsupported chamber causing failure in any one loading, but because it works the brass a lot less to have a tighter chamber overall, and I can shoot lead without any issues (yeah, I know folks who have shot lead hundreds of rounds with no issues, but I consider it cheap insurance).