Picture comparison of 6920 & Del-Ton

[teddy12b]

I started this thread here because I didn't want to hijack another good discussion. If you look at pages 10 & 11 of this thread https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...s_in_quality_order_from_best_to_worst-11.html you'll understand why I started this.

So anyway, I wanted to take a bunch of pictures tonight of my colt 6920 and my delton disipator kit gun. Being an internet forum we can't seem to stop talking about mil-spec this or comercial buffer that. What's all that mean to the average guy on INGO? We can decide that for ourselves, but I took a bunch of pictures tonight and I'll admit they didn't turn out that great, but hopefully they help out some. In all side by side pictures the colt piece is on the left.

Colt 6920 on left, Del-Ton Dissapator on right.

Bolt carrier groups from top view (6920 on left, DT on right)

Closer view of gas key staking (6920 on left, DT on right)

Side view, shows part of the full auto cut (6920 on left, DT on right)

Other side (6920 on left, DT on right)

Bolts (6920 on left, DT on right) The lettering didn't come out in the pictures so I'll just type in what's written on the bolts later.

Colt feed ramps

Del-Ton feed ramps

I didn't get any pictures of the 6920 barrel profile because I was in a rush to get this little amount done, but those pictures are all over the internet anyway.

So what can we notice:
*Gas Key staking looks identical to me.
*One carrier is full auto, the other isn't. With semi auto rifles you decide if that matters to you.
*Both bolts were marked in their own way about being tested. Unfortunately neither markings really came out in the pictures.
*The feed ramps on the Colt seem to be cut just slightly deeper, but not by much.
*The colt has a mil-spec diameter buffer tube, the delton is commercial. This wasn't pictured, but it's just another difference.


So what does all this really mean? Well, if I was ever going to convert the rifles to full auto the colt would have some advantages, but since that's never going to happen it's more of a moot point.

The mil-spec buffer tube is stronger, but that doesn't mean that a commercial buffer tube is weak. I don't plan on butt stroking anything with a carbine so I don't really care on that either.

The bolt carrier assemblies seem to be on par with each other in regard to the gas key staking and the bolt testing.

The most interesting fact is that both rifles have been equally reliable and fun to shoot. The colt has probably had another 500 - 800 rounds through it than the del-ton has, but both have been 100% reliable for me throughout their lives. Obviously, I'm impartial to the mil-spec vs non mil-spec hype since I've bought both, but I'm always curious when I start seeing the AR tier threads and how people rank rifles. I'm not saying either way is right or wrong, but ultimately at my house I've chosen the del-ton to be my accessable rifle is case I need one. The largest reason why I did that is because I've set it up for night time with the XS night sight on the front post and a flashlight and I didn't feel like doing that with the colt.

Once I get my PSA upper and finish that build maybe I'll update this thread as a three way. Those always sound good right?

 

[MikeDVB]

Can you label all of the images for an AR-Newb? I'd like to know what I'm looking at and specifically how one compares to the other. I know you outlined it at the bottom, but at least labeling the images would help .

 

[Bronsonbull]

Nice job. Del-ton is one of my favorites. I have a few and they have all been great. They used to be a nice kept secret. Now they don't have anything in stock

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Wow, I just completely blew past one being a full auto bolt carrier. I was, uh, looking at the other end. Yeah, that's the ticket. It's like I've taken to saying, the parts of the parts that have to interact with other parts have to be compatible enough to work with anybody's parts. That doesn't mean some parts aren't better than other parts, but I'd hope if someone's out of spec they won't get the respect.

 

[esrice]

Thanks for the pic comparison!

*Gas Key staking looks identical to me.

Poor gas key staking is one thing often seen on commercial rifles. Some have tiny little hash marks, or nothing at all.

Your DT looks good.

*One carrier is full auto, the other isn't. With semi auto rifles you decide if that matters to you.

A full-auto carrier has more mass, and therefore can slow down and smooth out cycling, even in a semi-auto gun. Having a full-auto carrier is also nice you have any buddies with full-auto lowers, so you can swap your upper and run it with a "happy switch".

*Both bolts were marked in their own way about being tested. Unfortunately neither markings really came out in the pictures.

How were they marked?

MPI/HP testing is one thing that guys often see on a "milspec" sheet and misunderstand exactly why it is important. A non-tested, or batch-tested bolt isn't inherently bad. It just means that the odds of getting one with issues increases. When the milspec calls for individual testing of each bolt, you can be assured that the bolt in your gun has passed the test and is free from stress cracks and deficiencies. Look at it as one way to fight against getting a lemon.

*The feed ramps on the Colt seem to be cut just slightly deeper, but not by much.

It could just be a case of your Colt being on the "high" side of the spec, and your DT on the "low" side.

*The colt has a mil-spec diameter buffer tube, the delton is commercial. This wasn't pictured, but it's just another difference.

You can tell by looking at the buttpad on the CTR.

The most interesting fact is that both rifles have been equally reliable and fun to shoot. The colt has probably had another 500 - 800 rounds through it than the del-ton has, but both have been 100% reliable for me throughout their lives.

At the end of the day this is the true test for any gun. I would be curious to see how the DT would run through a high-round-count carbine course, where things are hot, dirty, and fast.

 

[teddy12b]

Can you label all of the images for an AR-Newb?

Let me know if the changes I made help. If you need additional labels let me know.

 

[Fordtough25]

Nice comparison! I've had a cheaper AR, several middle range I guess and now a higher end. I love my setup now but I will say I had 0 problems with the other rifles. I have no plans to get into the super high end rifles like Noveske and LWRC, Colt has been making them since the beginning, I trust in them.

 

[teddy12b]

At the end of the day this is the true test for any gun. I would be curious to see how the DT would run through a high-round-count carbine course, where things are hot, dirty, and fast.

I've always questioned myself about how/when I could trust an AR with my life and that of my families. There's a lot of talk out there on specs, and that's all fine and dandy, but I've seen brand new M16's break. So when you build enough confidence with a rifle is largely subjective to everyone's wants. In my case, I took my delton with 300rds of ammo. The first half of the first mag was just to confirm zero and then I dumped all the remaining 300rds at the 300 yard target as fast as I could get back on target, pull the trigger change mags, and repeat. The barrel got hot as heck and whatever oil/crud that was on it was burning off in smoke. The forward grip was barely staying cool enough to keep my hand on it and the rifle still functioned 100% and hit the target at 300 yards.

As far as I'm concerned if a rifle can dump 300 rds and still function, that's more than I'm going to need in a firefight that I'd actually have a chance at living through on my own. As far as the rounds still hitting the target that's one of the things about the DT that appealed to me in the heavier profile barrel.

I'm not trying to say I'm right or wrong on any of this, but that's my reasoning.

Hopefully I'll get that PSA upper in the near future and I'll redo the picture comparison. In hindsight, there are some things that I like better about the PSA kits compared to the Del-Tons like the mil-spec buffer, full auto bcg, etc. But that's mostly just so I could uniformly swap part & stocks from one to another.

 

[Cerberus]

Teddy, how about a pic inside the lead end of the bolt carriers. Curious if the DT has that part chrome lined. Also what is the twist rate of the barrels, and are they chrome lined.

ETA:

As far as I'm concerned if a rifle can dump 300 rds and still function, that's more than I'm going to need in a firefight that I'd actually have a chance at living through on my own. As far as the rounds still hitting the target that's one of the things about the DT that appealed to me in the heavier profile barrel.

I doubt there are many amongst us that can say we've ever dumped that many rounds thru our rifles in a single real honest to God firefight. In 2 tours I never fired a single round thru mine.

 

[nipprdog]

The problem with the DT Dissy is that they use a rifle length gas system, in a carbine model, instead of doing it the correct way.

In fact, Delton will tell you that you need to run hot ammo to make sure its reliable;

Del-Ton Dissipator - THR

This is not a blatant Delton bashing. A while back, I was seriously looking at one getting one of their dissy uppers. But the gas length issue was a turn off.

That, and the fact that I was able to pick up a Spikes MOE midlength for $499 from AIM.

 

[teddy12b]

That's a fair concern to have. I've read that same comment from a lot of different people. Let's just keep it a secret though between us guys on the internet. I don't want my rifle to find out online that it's unreliable, lol. My handloads of 23.0gr of Ramshot TAC under a 69gr matchking are pretty far from a hot load, but they always seem to function.

 

[MikeDVB]

Let me know if the changes I made help. If you need additional labels let me know.

That's great, thank you.

I'm looking at getting my first AR15 soon, so seeing the parts broken down and a comparison is very helpful.

 

[dom1104]

I am not sure what the take away is from comparing 2 guns based on pics, but.....

nice Colt.

 

[U.S. Patriot]

Some carbines tend to be over gassed. That's why some companies run a full auto bolt carrier assembly. I switched to one myself, and I saw an improvement. All that beside, more money does not always mean a better product. Sometimes, it's a matter of paying for the name.

 

[zibby43]

Any pics of the extractor (taken down)?

Castle nut?

Thanks for the photos.

 

[MikeDVB]

Some carbines tend to be over gassed. That's why some companies run a full auto bolt carrier assembly. I switched to one myself, and I saw an improvement. All that beside, more money does not always mean a better product. Sometimes, it's a matter of paying for the name.

I need to do some reading on how the gas systems work, etc... Know of any good resources off-hand? I've never had a carbine.